Not to derail the thread...but looks like CJ Jones is a decent get, as is Scurry...and Fussell is a 3 star. Give him time.
Stockstill's Buyout...a Tale of Misery
- Thread starter rcodeman
- Start date
Not to derail the thread...but looks like CJ Jones is a decent get, as is Scurry...and Fussell is a 3 star. Give him time.
Understand why you wouldn’t want to reveal your convo with Boots but would love to get a readout of your chat with CM. If willing feel free to PM me.
I’d like to take a couple of days to digest everything we discussed and it would be great if others would reach out to him (in a civil manner of course) and share your thoughts. I appreciate that he took almost 90 min. of his afternoon to meet with me. I think he’s open to anything that would help get the facilities funding. It is a huge challenge for sure. That and attendance. It’s also a huge challenge and the Beer Garden may not be the cure all but it does get fans into the stadium. He also knows I’m not a Beer Garden patron. (-:
I’m going to the Rice game a week from Saturday afternoon if anyone else wants to sit with me and discuss this further. I think we’ll probably have our choice of where we want to sit together.
I’m not going to discuss the FSU issue again and will respect that it is an internal HR issue between employee and employer. I don’t think it was a very smart thing to do but I’m not his boss.
6-6 is the best we can finish and I respect that CM’s job is to do everything in his power to help the staff and team get there. He did mention we have 23 scholarship players out with injuries but injuries are part of the game for everyone.
He has read my posts of how I feel about “the contract” and it is what it is. We just agree to disagree.
You guys all have varying degrees of emotions and opinions just like me. Hopefully, we all have one common wish and that is to see this athletic program work out of this mess.
Last edited:
I too have met with him in the past. Sometimes it seems like this is an impossible job; however, we do things or don’t do things that make it so much harder on ourselves. Everyone has big ideas.
We’ve heard from leadership in the past that we try to model ourselves after Louisville or Boise or pick hot to trot program. The reality is that’s all talk and we don’t see the implementation behind that. We have $30+ million dollar budget but we spend chump change on recruiting. We play a lot of body bag games on top of it and it’s obvious we don’t get our bang for our buck. USMs and La Techs budget is nearly half ours yet they produce similarly or better pending tour perspective. I’m sure ODU fans feel the same way. We aren’t the only ones in this boat but it doesn’t mean I have to like it or accept it. I just feel like culturally we accept average at MT. I may be in the minority but I prefer being successful more than I enjoy sitting back watching it play out with a beer in my hand. Actually I kind of like the idea of doing both those things.
We’ve heard from leadership in the past that we try to model ourselves after Louisville or Boise or pick hot to trot program. The reality is that’s all talk and we don’t see the implementation behind that. We have $30+ million dollar budget but we spend chump change on recruiting. We play a lot of body bag games on top of it and it’s obvious we don’t get our bang for our buck. USMs and La Techs budget is nearly half ours yet they produce similarly or better pending tour perspective. I’m sure ODU fans feel the same way. We aren’t the only ones in this boat but it doesn’t mean I have to like it or accept it. I just feel like culturally we accept average at MT. I may be in the minority but I prefer being successful more than I enjoy sitting back watching it play out with a beer in my hand. Actually I kind of like the idea of doing both those things.
As for the contract I’ve already said my peace on it. But will offer one caveat. I actually like the premise. I believe it behooves us to add incentives to the contract that can be triggered. I like the idea of moderated raises and automatic extensions. It actually keeps us from overpaying in one fell swoop. Problem is I just think the bar was set too low. Initially only getting to six wins. And then upped to seven. That’s not the barometer for automatic incentives in my opinion nor is indicative of a culture of a highly successful program. While I like the premise of it in principle the thresholds to trigger those clauses should be...
1. Conference title
2. Ten win season.
3. Major bowl appearance (could be an add on to the above two)
4. Conference coach of the year.
5. And while also meeting those also meeting an APR Mark (I would go with 90 or something like that).
1. Conference title
2. Ten win season.
3. Major bowl appearance (could be an add on to the above two)
4. Conference coach of the year.
5. And while also meeting those also meeting an APR Mark (I would go with 90 or something like that).
I totally agree. When we first made it to Detroit and then 3 years later won NO, it made full sense to do an extension. The bar was set to me for a bowl every year. To me that means 7 wins. (A bowl team should not finish with a losing record ie 6-7). Then the following two years make it 8 wins. Then 9. And so forth. Set a bar for gradual expectations that can be reached. But hey. I’m just an AD with a message board degree.
I am pleased he is meeting with people and listening. I only hope he truly takes suggestions to heart as they are coming from our hearts.
I appreciate you posting this.
I appreciate you posting this.
The problem is, he is not willing to make the changes necessary to address the challenges you mentioned.
Attendance is down across college football. Attendance goes up with changes that generate excitement, followed by consistent high level winning.
The fact he feels the contract & results don’t warrant change directly link to attendance staying down. Don’t complain about the challenge when you (CM) are unwilling to address the elephant in room that everyone knows is a major part of the problem.
Also, don’t talk about the challenge of fundraising when you refuse to address problem A and your alumni organization/BRAA are terrible at alumni outreach/involvement. I deal with 5 schools at different levels and MT functions at the same level as the community college in terms of outreach. Actually, the MT dept I graduated out of does better than the BRAA and alumni association- combined.
I completely disagree about Brent being an “internal issue”. He publicly promoted RS for another job. Maybe I am used to SEC or AAC schools, that have real newspaper reporters asking real questions, but this should at least be acknowledged publicly. Not acknowledging it leads to distrust that you did anything other than a simple reprimand.
Finally, Chris needs to actually publicly address this. He knows most of the remaining passionate fans do not like the stagnant coaching/contract. He knows we have the issues we all talk about over and over, yet it seems he does nothing to address. Acknowledge the problems and concerns publicly Chris. I would really appreciate you saying I hear people saying they don’t like the state of the program, but here is why the contract & situation makes since.
It’s great to take time to talk to some in person, but how about addressing these publicly, because you know they exist? The football program is stagnant and needs a spark - what are you willing to do?
Unless Chris does these things publicly, in a letter or interview, he is perpetuating the problem.
My immediate thought before clicking on the link was that the Brock story had made the National Media.
I thought the same thing. Started reading and thought wow that’s crazy but also was thinking well crap on not being about Brock.
Could work, but he would have to a strong OC and DC.
Was Sanders the guy who only a season ago didn't know who Kevin Byard is?
He may have been a great athlete, but the fact that he did not know who Byard was shows me he's been skating/coasting in his current job, and I think that portends poor results if he becomes the head coach of fsu.
Do not see us landing the recruits? Jackson last year, Fussell this year committed and got a visit from a 4* top 150 player. He is a better recruiter than Kermit. Not to mention I am really impressed with the recruits he brought in his first year given the situation. I think you are giving yourself and your “model” too much credit.
Well 11-21 says otherwise particularly given what we had done the previous seven years. i don’t give a damn about visits. What matters is what level of talent not only signs, but also shows up and contributes in a meaningful way to build toward championships and NCAA tournaments. So jury is out. We will just have to wait and see.
Put 95% of coaches in the same situation and the results would be similar. By the time he got there the three recruits we had coming in had probably already made up their minds to leave. Then he had the players dismissed for whatever reason. People can argue they shouldn't have been dismissed, but you can make that decision when you get hired to coach the basketball team. He was having to put a roster together with very little time. Had a player that fit the mold of what he wanted decide to not play anymore in Shelton-Schmidt. Now in his second year one of his starting forwards goes down for the year, the other one is out for the first 11 games, and we forget Junior had to leave. When you look at our OOC schedule last year and how we rebounded in conference it showed promise. I am not connected to this coach one way or another. I just know what I have seen and I like it so far. I could be wrong. If Fussell signs and we land Houston I think we will compete for the conference next year and we may even do it without Houston. We only lose Scurry and Green and we get Dishman back with Jordan Davis and Jalen Jordan becoming eligible to play.
Football Scoop has us firing Stock.....and hiring Tee Martin?
https://footballscoop.com/news/footballscoops-nuclear-winter-v/
Ok, this is for entertainment purposes only, and is just kind of a fluffy filler piece on how they think the offseason might go, with a little humor thrown in - so I wouldn't take it too seriously.
BUT.......this is the first time i've seen anything outside of this message board/fan base indicate that maybe, just maybe, there's some dissatisfaction with Stock. I've always felt that the local media, and even the national/regional media (when it bothers to discuss MT) always presented it as we should be lucky to have a coach with such sustained "success" and that how dare we expect something bigger/better.
https://footballscoop.com/news/footballscoops-nuclear-winter-v/
Ok, this is for entertainment purposes only, and is just kind of a fluffy filler piece on how they think the offseason might go, with a little humor thrown in - so I wouldn't take it too seriously.
BUT.......this is the first time i've seen anything outside of this message board/fan base indicate that maybe, just maybe, there's some dissatisfaction with Stock. I've always felt that the local media, and even the national/regional media (when it bothers to discuss MT) always presented it as we should be lucky to have a coach with such sustained "success" and that how dare we expect something bigger/better.
We ain't got 6.5 mill laying around to hit the eject button on Stock but if we have 3 more of these seasons then maybe. 
I don't think Stockstill goes anywhere BUT Tee Martin is a power 5 WR coach so he is perfectly qualified to be head coach at MT...
The post on football scoop has 3 different notices it’s for entertainment.
it’s not real, it’s satire.
Yep, made that clear in the post.
But again, even if satire, this is still the first time I've seen anyone, anywhere (and football scoop is pretty well connected) even intimate that maybe things aren't all good at MT.
You said that, but then take something from the article to actually have meaning.
I think they were actually looking for a HC gig for Tee Martin more than saying they recognize trouble at here. Then again, anyone who has seen us play would realize we have problems.
What was the word from Massaro on that? Anybody get a response other that - we are handling internally?
is there no local media that would even want to take a 5 minute phone call to see what little Chris has to say about it? Come on it’s a softball, easy quick blurb for the media.
is there no local media that would even want to take a 5 minute phone call to see what little Chris has to say about it? Come on it’s a softball, easy quick blurb for the media.
Look, it's not a serious piece.
But it's also not like they have Clemson firing Dabo and OU giving the boot to Lincoln Riley just for fun.
The places that they name are programs that could conceivably have a change due to performance issues. MT was one of them. That's all.
I don't agree with it being handled behind closed doors. His act took place in a public forum for all to see but he gets "corrected" in private. Like you said, the athletic department is a joke.
I was being sarcastic... I don't want a position coach from any level to be a head coach at MT.
There are plenty of successful head coaches from lower levels who would be more likely to have success than a position coach who has never been a head coach.
As much as anyone else here, I didn’t like it either. That said, I’m not for publicly firing him. I’m going to stick to my guns of trying to stay positive, root for 6-6, and then see what staff changes Massaro and Stock make after the season. He didn’t wake up one morning and decide to become a bad coach overnight. Hopefully, the heartburn of this season will get him to self-evaluate. Good news is we have Shafer on a longer term contract and didn’t lose him to his buddy at Pitt.
See you Saturday at 3:30. Go Blue.
He was. But he also was Asst Head Coach and was intermin after Bowden left.
I agree we can do better. There are plenty of up and coming energetic young guns that are eager to move up. And if he leaves in a few years for a bigger program, as I’ve said before, I’m ok with that too.
But neither here nor there. Stock is here. Let’s just make the most of it and hope he does as well.
Yep:
2007–2008 Clemson (AHC/WR)
2008 Clemson (interim HC/OC)
2009–present Clemson
A coaches experience/success at their previous job doesn't mean they will be more or less successful at their new job but the more information you have the better.
Heck, look at Watson Brown. He was a great OC but a very mediocre head coach. At the pro level Norv Turner is a great OC but only an average head coach. Same with Wade Phillips - great DC but not much of a head coach.
Give me a head coach who has built a winner at a lower level.
Just throwing out a hypothetical here...if we hire a coach who has built a winner a lower level, that lower level would be OVC, etc. Would you be ok hiring Austin Peay's head coach like Charlotte did? With our facilities and lack of support, a successful coach in the Sun Belt isn't looking to "move up" to MTSU.
I thought we should've hire the current peay coach back when andy mccollum was finally given the boot...
I have to say, I think the Peay AD has made two pretty great hires the last two times they had to hire a football coach. When we have an opening at AD we need to look at what has been done there in Clarksville.
