Don’t comment on something then if you don’t know what you are talking about. That was a big point and a big mistake at the end of the game and you don’t even know what happened.
BASKETBALL Middle Tennessee vs UNC-W, 4PM, Wednesday, March 23, 2022
- Thread starter SpaceRaider
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37 games in.. none of them are freshmen anymore- that’s a cop out.. they win and lose as a team..
Sims makes one FT in regulation this is all moot.. he’ll relive that his whole life
Incorrect. I never said he couldn’t. I said it was going to be very difficult because most kids don’t want to play for a loser.
He might but he shouldn’t. Without Sims we lose by double digits.
I do know what happened. Lenard hugged a guy at the wrong time. He has played basketball most his life. I would think he would know he can’t do that. No one play lost the game. If everyone stopped commenting on what they don’t know about this board should be silent.
UNCw is a team stacked with seniors that know how to win games. They thrived in those end game situations. Having 3 guys that shoot 80% or more from the FT line is deadly. They knew how to attack the rim and they earned every basket and maybe a few more. The officiating was fair.
the better team won. I wish nothing but the best for them, but they will be rebuilding next year. This was their peak (for now).
MT on the other hand is loaded with young talent and primed for a big run these next 2 years and maybe more if Nick can find more studs.
but now comes the hardest part, keeping this team together. Nearly everyone on the roster still has their free 1 time transfer available without having to sit out. I believe Dishman is the only one who would have to sit, and he’s a senior, so he isn’t going anywhere. And of course the two injured guys that transferred in, jalen Jordan and Coleman-Jones.
Sucks how this game ended. We had many opportunities to win, but mistakes made by many people caused us to lose. Doesn’t take away from an amazing season. At the end of the day we should all be proud of this team.
Yeah, with each team paying $50,000, I was wondering if the winner and possibly the runner-up got a payout.
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Sims is 100% going to beat himself up over the opportunities he got tonight and in the CUSA semi. A 90% ft shooter and he cannot hit it when it matters. Y’all are right though, it wouldn’t have been close if it wasn’t for him. Still super proud of the team and it was fun even though the season was a bit infuriating at times.
Compete and participate is what we do. Even if we have to pay to play. We may as well be a D3 operation. I’d love to know the total expenses for the trip. Team and “official party”.
I had family priorities and last checked my CBS Sports game tracker when time ran out at 70-70. Tough loss for the kids.
Consider yourself lucky. It was not a fun game to watch....maybe one of the most frustrating I've ever seen to be honest. We essentially led wire-to-wire and let them sneak it into OT at the very end. Our shooting was terrible all night, something like 21% from 3 and not much better from 2. Felt like the other team scored more points from the FT line than anywhere else. Only thing that kept us in the game was our rebounding. Everything else was pretty bad. We shot terribly, which is unfortunate because that's not what I expected from this team in a championship setting.
I watched and lived through this mess. Where is the coaching? Where is the free throw shooting? It’s not Simms fault. The team never learned to close a tight game. When you are in tournament time most games are close. You have to hit the free throws. If CNM can follow this up with a conference championship I’ll buy in. If we stink at free throws and end up in a pay to play tournament again it’s time to say good bye to CNM. Now what will really happen is as follows. CNM a will be given a pay raise and a contract that will look like the stockstill contract. Did anyone see a play called or drawn up at any time out. The coach from UNCG seemed to have plays dialed up at every TO. A much better season with a rotten egg at the end.
He had a few good plays. The Sims 3 to tie the game with 6 seconds left was out of a timeout and well drawn up. He admittedly didn't have many other options because nobody else could hit a 3 pointer all night long.
The Lenard intentional foul was really a blunder though. Nick needed to be more clear with Lenard on WHEN to foul instead of just telling him to do it. I feel bad for Lenard there.
We did win 26 games which was 21 more than last year. That is a record turn around and quite frankly, an insane turn around. That's significant progress and when you look at the roster, we are absolutely primed for a run. I'm not familiar with how many years Nick has left but does he even need a contract extension ? Can't we see another year and then decide?? He's probably earned at least a 1 year extension to be honest but if we can wait then just wait.
2022-2023 season becomes very crucial in my opinion. Can Nick keep this team together and have another 20+ win season and win the East, or do we lose multiple key players and take a step back ? Lenard, Lawrence, and maybe Weston could all probably "upgrade" to a "bigger" program but it wouldn't be the Alabama's that come calling. Maybe an Oregon State or South Florida, etc. and they probably wouldn't be starters for those programs.
I think he should be able to keep them together. I'm hopeful. To go from 5 wins to 26 has to be a special ride and this team has to have become closer to one another. My gut tells me they stay together, but there's also the potential they start leaving like dominos falling much like our defensive backfield in Football where there was a chain reaction of transfer announcements after the first one.
The Lenard intentional foul was really a blunder though. Nick needed to be more clear with Lenard on WHEN to foul instead of just telling him to do it. I feel bad for Lenard there.
We did win 26 games which was 21 more than last year. That is a record turn around and quite frankly, an insane turn around. That's significant progress and when you look at the roster, we are absolutely primed for a run. I'm not familiar with how many years Nick has left but does he even need a contract extension ? Can't we see another year and then decide?? He's probably earned at least a 1 year extension to be honest but if we can wait then just wait.
2022-2023 season becomes very crucial in my opinion. Can Nick keep this team together and have another 20+ win season and win the East, or do we lose multiple key players and take a step back ? Lenard, Lawrence, and maybe Weston could all probably "upgrade" to a "bigger" program but it wouldn't be the Alabama's that come calling. Maybe an Oregon State or South Florida, etc. and they probably wouldn't be starters for those programs.
I think he should be able to keep them together. I'm hopeful. To go from 5 wins to 26 has to be a special ride and this team has to have become closer to one another. My gut tells me they stay together, but there's also the potential they start leaving like dominos falling much like our defensive backfield in Football where there was a chain reaction of transfer announcements after the first one.
First off it was UNCW we played. Second, we were one of the worst free throw shooting teams in the country one year under Kermit. Was that coaching too? The best way to learn how to close a tight game is to experience it. UNCW had 3 1,000 point scorers on their team and they won 27 games. We lost a game in double OT against a very good and experienced team without our best player. Inexcusable to miss those free throws, but that is not on one person.
......so Middle. 😐. It WAS a great year and I am excited about basketball again. We'll see.
Excuse my typo of one letter Joe lunardi jr. I never blamed one player. I don’t care if we played Duke. Mental errors and free throws cost us the game. Based on our players technical foul and his look at CNM my thinking is the foul was called by the coach. I think the coach called for a foul. I doubt it was that type of foul. Apparently the coach needs to coach harder and more clearly. The out of total control drives down the stretch were ugly. They were the better team because we were out of control and could not hit free throws. BTW did you call Joe Lunardi to correct his Simms confusion during the game.
Now we’ll wait to see if the shot callers give CNM another extension. My personal feeling is that he was given an unearned one after going 11-21. Austin called them out publicly for that one back in November in his epic article “How Did We Get Here”. It wouldn’t surprise me though, given the last vote taken this month by the BOT on a different employee’s contract. Don’t care. I’m at the point that I’ll just stay away until all of them retire or move on and will only attend the single games that appeal to me.
https://middletennessee.n.rivals.com/news/how-did-we-get-here--1
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I hate the way this game and the UAB game ended- I'm pretty sure we all do because we feel this team deserved better- they turned things around, they persevered when Jefferson went down at such a critical time.. so this feeling sucks..
The TEAM lost this game. There were countless plays that lead to that point, FT misses by multiple guys in regulation and both OT's, really bad fouls by multiple guys in the 2OT; we can debate the CNM/Lenard technical and whether or not a freshman should've been told more explicitly but what about Sims' dead-ball foul on UNCW's OOB play before the ball was even inbounded with 24 seconds remaining? That's a 5th year senior who has played 140 college games and there was only 13 seconds on the shot clock.. let UNCW inbound the ball and play good defense there, secure the rebound and MT could've had the ball with plenty of time remaining and only down by 1... that's just one play.. The TEAM lost this game- all of them, we can all single out or dwell on key plays all day long and both the coaching staff and the players would love to relive something they wish they did different.. it's the coaches job to put players in positions to be successful- they did that well overall but lacked in some moments. It's the players jobs to make plays, sometimes they did, sometimes they didn't.. let's all get off the individual blame train- it's pointless.
For the first time we saw the lack of depth on this MT team- Jefferson was out, Elias rolled his ankle but the team's guard depth was still ok.. but when Dish fouled out the game got ugly(ier) offensively.. MT is FAR less effective and efficient when he is not on the court.. he opens up driving lanes and facilitates the offense in ways that Fussell and Millin simply don't at this point in their careers.. Dish has softer hands and finishes in traffic better and defenses are less likely to leave him to help on drives.. not to mention he's been a beast on iso plays in the post lately..
Overall the poor shooting and lack of assisted plays was the main difference, part of that was UNCW's defense and part of that was reverting back to poor shot selection and guys trying to do a little too much.. sucks to learn this way but if these types of losses motivates the returning guys to work harder this off season (starting today) then I'll take it.. still I think we all wanted more for this group- but you have to do more than just deserve it, you have to go get it and finish the deal. Hopefully this team learns that lesson going forward.
The TEAM lost this game. There were countless plays that lead to that point, FT misses by multiple guys in regulation and both OT's, really bad fouls by multiple guys in the 2OT; we can debate the CNM/Lenard technical and whether or not a freshman should've been told more explicitly but what about Sims' dead-ball foul on UNCW's OOB play before the ball was even inbounded with 24 seconds remaining? That's a 5th year senior who has played 140 college games and there was only 13 seconds on the shot clock.. let UNCW inbound the ball and play good defense there, secure the rebound and MT could've had the ball with plenty of time remaining and only down by 1... that's just one play.. The TEAM lost this game- all of them, we can all single out or dwell on key plays all day long and both the coaching staff and the players would love to relive something they wish they did different.. it's the coaches job to put players in positions to be successful- they did that well overall but lacked in some moments. It's the players jobs to make plays, sometimes they did, sometimes they didn't.. let's all get off the individual blame train- it's pointless.
For the first time we saw the lack of depth on this MT team- Jefferson was out, Elias rolled his ankle but the team's guard depth was still ok.. but when Dish fouled out the game got ugly(ier) offensively.. MT is FAR less effective and efficient when he is not on the court.. he opens up driving lanes and facilitates the offense in ways that Fussell and Millin simply don't at this point in their careers.. Dish has softer hands and finishes in traffic better and defenses are less likely to leave him to help on drives.. not to mention he's been a beast on iso plays in the post lately..
Overall the poor shooting and lack of assisted plays was the main difference, part of that was UNCW's defense and part of that was reverting back to poor shot selection and guys trying to do a little too much.. sucks to learn this way but if these types of losses motivates the returning guys to work harder this off season (starting today) then I'll take it.. still I think we all wanted more for this group- but you have to do more than just deserve it, you have to go get it and finish the deal. Hopefully this team learns that lesson going forward.
I wonder if conditioning played a role?
I just went back and looked - at the 6:04 mark of the 2nd half, we were shooting 87.5% from the line. In the final 16 minutes, including OT, we shot 59%. That kind of drop off screams conditioning to me. UNCW numbers never dropped off.
For the other discussion, it looked to me that CNM was telling them who to foul before the FT went up & then was pointing him out after the make so someone could find and foul. While an intentional foul call is possible at that point, I would expect someone that has any basketball experience even through HS to know that you cannot foul the way he did.
I did not intend for it to sound like you said it was on one person. That was just a general statement. Sometimes a coach provides clear instructions and a player still does not execute as intended. There were bad plays and stupid mistakes from pretty much everyone. To automatically assume CNM did not coach hard or clear enough may be wrong. It may be right. CBI or not, CNM took a team further in a postseason tournament than Kermit ever did. He did it without his full team again. I think the future is bright and CNM deserves a lot of the credit for this season. It is a heck of a coaching job to keep the team’s confidence up after the past few seasons.
An extension wouldn't surprise me. I'm like you. Shouldn't have gotten the last one and we should hold off till next year on the next one (one good 2009 year anyone?)
Am I hopeful, absolutely. Excited for next season, absolutely. Bought in to McD yet, nope. I hope this isn't a "flash in the pan" season. If we hit 20 games again next year, then I'll be "bALL IN".
I'm hoping he will be over .500 after next season. We shall see.
I think we will be better next season as long as Fussell or Coleman-Jones can fill in for Dish. He could come back, but I don’t think he plans to. Could also get someone from the portal. We may take a slight step back in the backcourt, but Weston, Jordan, and Lawrence are more than capable. If everyone takes another big step forward we could have a very good season.
The way this team played this season won me over. Not necessarily the W's, but the fire and intensity they showed throughout an entire game. I've said it before here, but they were just fun to watch. Really hope the team sticks together. I have never had basketball season tickets before, but I plan on buying at least one for myself next year
One player, FT, or foul didn't cost us the game. We got beat. It happens. The returning players will learn from yesterday, and be better for it.
I was critical of CNM at the end of last season, and I will gladly admit he proved me wrong this year. Happy for him, his staff, and his players. 26 wins, including a sweep over BG Correctional, made for a fun season.
In my opinion, this was his first season where we could see how he got the reputation as a great recruiter. Already excited for next year.
Hats off to Sims on a great career. He was here for the highest of the highs, and the lowest of the lows, and he stuck it out through all of it. That kind of loyalty and hard work will pay dividends in the next phase of his life.
I was critical of CNM at the end of last season, and I will gladly admit he proved me wrong this year. Happy for him, his staff, and his players. 26 wins, including a sweep over BG Correctional, made for a fun season.
In my opinion, this was his first season where we could see how he got the reputation as a great recruiter. Already excited for next year.
Hats off to Sims on a great career. He was here for the highest of the highs, and the lowest of the lows, and he stuck it out through all of it. That kind of loyalty and hard work will pay dividends in the next phase of his life.
Sure the team lost the game. However, in college sports you rely on seniors to pull you through tight games. I’ll continue to say the UAB game and this one are mostly on Sims. His biggest strength is FTs and he couldn’t hit it when the team needed him to. He gave it his all and I’m proud of that but if we’re planning to be big time then seniors don’t get a pass imo. I grew up a Clemson fan. I went to South Carolina and Louisville. That’s what big time fan bases do. Nick also gets blame for putting a freshman in a bad position. That should have been a upperclassman doing that. Overall I’m excited for next year and proud of the team. They exceeded expectations and nobody honestly thought we would even be having these conversations.
I will defend Donovan just a bit. Everyone's comments about the missed FT implied that making it would have sealed the game. It would have still been a one-possession game with a make, and UNCW had just hit a long two and a contested 3 prior to that. Obviously it would have made a tie much more difficult to obtain, but to suggest making both would have put the game out of reach is inaccurate. In addition, he made a clutch 3 that bailed us out in the first OT.
That said, it's easy to be disappointed in the immediate term, but hard to be upset about the season as a whole. UNCW looked and played like an experienced team down the stretch. Our guys have not had that same type of experience to this point. My hope is that this run of one-and-done games to end the season helps build that "clutch" gene.
I will say, it had been a while since I felt that feeling of emotional investment that comes along with having a good team with aspirations and something to play for. It was nice to get worked up again. I'm exceedingly pleased with the product we put on the court this season, and I'm ready to be a perennial contender again.
That said, it's easy to be disappointed in the immediate term, but hard to be upset about the season as a whole. UNCW looked and played like an experienced team down the stretch. Our guys have not had that same type of experience to this point. My hope is that this run of one-and-done games to end the season helps build that "clutch" gene.
I will say, it had been a while since I felt that feeling of emotional investment that comes along with having a good team with aspirations and something to play for. It was nice to get worked up again. I'm exceedingly pleased with the product we put on the court this season, and I'm ready to be a perennial contender again.
You bring up a good point. I wrote off MBB at the end of last season. I was upset at our plunge. Last night and even this morning I was mad. This is a loss. We got beat but it got me stirred up and excited. It’s has been quite a while since I have been fired up. LETS. GO BLUE!
It’s a great problem to have. The fact we are upset shows a level of investment that hasn’t been there for awhile. I’m excited to see if Nick can add to it next year.
We were ranked 47th out of 350 teams in free throw shooting. We're pretty good there. Plus, we had 26 wins and played for a tourney title. Not even Kermit got us that close to a tourney championship. We're all sad about the loss but this season was no bust. Not by a long shot.
Agree about it being a great year. Most of the kids on this roster have been through hell the last few years with loss after loss after loss. They did not appear to be any light at the end of the tunnel, for the players or for the fans. They kept working hard and never gave up and ended up delivering a record turn around 26 win season. Nothing short of amazing. They should be very proud of themselves and I hope a lot of fans show up next year to give them the support they deserve.
And after consideration, they should maybe consider extending Nick. Nothing crazy, but I think we have the right guy here. Add 2-3 years, no salary increases as he's already being very well paid for a CUSA coach, put a fat buyout in there incase he leaves.
The roster was thin and hamstrung when he arrived. We were thin on available scholarship players which not only made games tough, but practices tough too. He did miss on several recruits the first few years which didn't do him any favors but it appears he's learned what he needs to win here and he has proven his system and philosophy can win and likely win big here at MT. My only concern at this point is maintaining the roster/attrition going forward. We have some "poachable" guys now and we all know about the great players that left UNCA for greener pastures when he was the coach there.
And after consideration, they should maybe consider extending Nick. Nothing crazy, but I think we have the right guy here. Add 2-3 years, no salary increases as he's already being very well paid for a CUSA coach, put a fat buyout in there incase he leaves.
The roster was thin and hamstrung when he arrived. We were thin on available scholarship players which not only made games tough, but practices tough too. He did miss on several recruits the first few years which didn't do him any favors but it appears he's learned what he needs to win here and he has proven his system and philosophy can win and likely win big here at MT. My only concern at this point is maintaining the roster/attrition going forward. We have some "poachable" guys now and we all know about the great players that left UNCA for greener pastures when he was the coach there.
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Narrative, not the bastardized version politics has twisted.
A senior laden team hit their peak and went out with a trophy after a hard fought 2OT final vs the young ascendant injury decimated team. For the champ, they move on to rebuild. For the young ascendant team, they are still climbing with an unknown ceiling.
For MT, there is much more to this story. Seeing the high regard, enthusiasm, fun, and cohesive nature of the team gives me hope that these young men will want to continue together into the future as a team. With the recent success and CNM's ability to develop quality relationships with players, I'm hopeful this team will attract quality maybe even better players to fill in for the departing seniors.
If this team can learn from their mistakes or misfires and work hard to improve this offseason, next year could even be more impressive. If they do continue to improve, then these late season painful OT losses will be remembered as just some growing pains on the way to big successes. The rest of this story has yet to be written, but the stage has been set for an epic future story of success to tell if this team seizes their potential destiny that is waiting to be written.
A senior laden team hit their peak and went out with a trophy after a hard fought 2OT final vs the young ascendant injury decimated team. For the champ, they move on to rebuild. For the young ascendant team, they are still climbing with an unknown ceiling.
For MT, there is much more to this story. Seeing the high regard, enthusiasm, fun, and cohesive nature of the team gives me hope that these young men will want to continue together into the future as a team. With the recent success and CNM's ability to develop quality relationships with players, I'm hopeful this team will attract quality maybe even better players to fill in for the departing seniors.
If this team can learn from their mistakes or misfires and work hard to improve this offseason, next year could even be more impressive. If they do continue to improve, then these late season painful OT losses will be remembered as just some growing pains on the way to big successes. The rest of this story has yet to be written, but the stage has been set for an epic future story of success to tell if this team seizes their potential destiny that is waiting to be written.
Some more thoughts:
Two upper classmen probable starters were sidelined for the season before the season even started. Another upper classman leader had to try to recover from two years of injuries to be the main contributor in the frontcourt. It seemed to take Dishman about half the season to get his legs back under him, but it is nothing less than incredibly impressive his production after overcoming such big injuries.
March arrived with another big, probably biggest, loss of leading scorer and senior to another injury. Most any other team would have ended their season with an early quiet out in their conference tournament, but not this bunch of eager hungry upstarts! Despite a couple of lackluster road performances to close out the regular conference season, this team found a way to still grow and get better.
Dish practically put this team on his back to achieve some postseason success. Perhaps just as impressive was watching this young team still find a way to perform despite the critical loss of their top player. With each postseason game, it was incredible to watch this team of mostly young players still figure out how to get better each game despite the adversity. If these young players stick together and work hard to improve in the offseason, then they could be setting up for one whale of a next season.
Think about this, what G5/mid-major team could even had made any postseason run in even the lesser known postseason tournament with 3 starters (at least starter caliber) on the bench with injuries?
Two upper classmen probable starters were sidelined for the season before the season even started. Another upper classman leader had to try to recover from two years of injuries to be the main contributor in the frontcourt. It seemed to take Dishman about half the season to get his legs back under him, but it is nothing less than incredibly impressive his production after overcoming such big injuries.
March arrived with another big, probably biggest, loss of leading scorer and senior to another injury. Most any other team would have ended their season with an early quiet out in their conference tournament, but not this bunch of eager hungry upstarts! Despite a couple of lackluster road performances to close out the regular conference season, this team found a way to still grow and get better.
Dish practically put this team on his back to achieve some postseason success. Perhaps just as impressive was watching this young team still find a way to perform despite the critical loss of their top player. With each postseason game, it was incredible to watch this team of mostly young players still figure out how to get better each game despite the adversity. If these young players stick together and work hard to improve in the offseason, then they could be setting up for one whale of a next season.
Think about this, what G5/mid-major team could even had made any postseason run in even the lesser known postseason tournament with 3 starters (at least starter caliber) on the bench with injuries?
Because of our present conference affiliation, at a minimum, the Head Coaches of Football, Men’s BB and Women’s BB should be incentivized FIRST AND FOREMOST on winning conference championships. Without that, we miss The Big Dance, the NIT, or a decent bowl game. Then we pay $50,000 for the “privilege” to play in front of a handful of spectators on FloTV or get sentenced to the Bahamas or Hawaii. Division titles and bowl participation banners just won’t cut it.
FWIW.
FWIW.
Yea, horrible leadership from the conference on down is frustrating to behold. Conference Championships should be a primary goal. Weirdly, it seems C-USA might actually improve a little in MBB with the new members. FB remains to be seen, but it is a strange development to see that MBB might actually improve.
I certainly love performance based bonuses, I use them in my business and it’s always worked well. We have proven multiple times however that we don’t necessarily have to win the conference to go to the big dance. Point taken tho
You also don't want to create a lame duck coaching situation and expect your talented kids not to transfer away to programs where the head coach does have multiple years remaining on his contract- hard to sign talented kids if you have a no-faith situation.... I think you set up metrics and have minimum standards for annual 1- year extensions- like this year I would think CNM would warrant a 1 year extension whereas you obviously wouldn't extend the past 2 years- that 1st extension received was based on other pre-existing circumstances not related to performance as I understand.. exceeding original/benchmark expectations (i.e. an extended NCAA tourney run, sweeping conference titles, etc) would certainly warrant the consideration of a multiple year extension
I’m still in a wait and see mindset. No one is hiring CNM away this off-season. We will go into next year with a lot of unknowns as of right now. I think the optimal time to extend would be if they go through OOC next year with a solid record, similar to this year, and start conference play beating a few teams. If that happens, then extend him and increase the buyout. Nothing crazy just a little more meat on the bones in case someone poached him. That should be the mindset pretty much every season so we don’t commit long term in case it reverses.
The OOC needs to get beefed up this coming season. Last year's was not the greatest. We had a good season and are expected to be good this season so we should be able to get some decent teams on the schedule. Kermit always tried to schedule as tough as possible let's hope Mcdevitt has a similar philosophy. Vandy and Belmont should be no brainers.
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