BASKETBALL Middle Tennessee @ Belmont (ESPN+), 7PM, Monday, 11/12/18

[crposton]

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We have no defense. We will be lucky to win 12 games this season. No D, no wins. It can never be all offense all the time. No team is that hot forever. I've been saying this and will continue to. Davis coached D which is why we were in and won as many games as we did. CNM's offense will put up more points but if your D is swiss cheese, it doesn't matter.

Marshall?

 

[MT-PAIN]

When we were winning this game, everyone liked Nick's style of play. When we lost, the world was ending.

Personally I think it was lack of talent on the team. We went ice cold and looked confused. Hopefully, everyone, including Nick can learn and grow.

 

[sWiley]

When we were winning this game, everyone liked Nick's style of play.

It was fools gold though. We were shooting 60%. That's not going to consistently happen, thus it's not a sustainable and reliable way to try and win games.

I think it was a combination of things.

1. Lack of talent

2. Lack of depth

3. Coach in his first year with a bunch of new players

4. Lack of discipline on defense

The first 3 I mentioned I can give Nick a pass on because it's his first year. At some point we've gotta be more disciplined and play some defense though. I don't believe it's a coincidence that his former school, UNCA, got torched 100-49 by NC State tonight which is just unacceptable. They're in a similar situation with a depleted roster and new coaches, but those are all his old players and I strongly suspect they're running systems very similar to what Nick ran.

Defense is not optional in college basketball. It's just not. Kansas, Duke, and the blue bloods can sometimes afford to get into those high scoring shoot-outs and play lackadasical defense but that's because they are all 5* talent and CAN typically pour in the points regardless. We simply are not good enough, and never will be good enough, to just thumb our noses at defense. There will be many nights where we struggle to put the ball in the basket. Gotta be able to D up the opponent and limit turnovers. I don't feel we even played good D against the Division 2 opponents. Gonna be a long season.

 

[RandallThomason]

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Marshall?

Marshall is actually a great example of how you have to have a commitment to defense to be a championship team. On a per possession basis (critically important when evaluating Marshall because they play so fast), Marshall’s defense last year was by far the best of the Dan D’Antoni era. They ranked in the top 35% of D1 in points allowed per possession and were one of the country’s best teams at not putting opponents on the line. In the two years prior to last year, they ranked 260th and 273rd in points allowed per possession. Their offensive production last year was actually slightly below their offensive level in the two prior years. They became a championship caliber team because they learned to play some D.

 

[sWiley]

Marshall is actually a great example of how you have to have a commitment to defense to be a championship team. On a per possession basis (critically important when evaluating Marshall because they play so fast), Marshall’s defense last year was by far the best of the Dan D’Antoni era. They ranked in the top 35% of D1 in points allowed per possession and were one of the country’s best teams at not putting opponents on the line. In the two years prior to last year, they ranked 260th and 273rd in points allowed per possession. Their offensive production last year was actually slightly below their offensive level in the two prior years. They became a championship caliber team because they learned to play some D.

Excellent, excellent observation, Randall.

Defense is not optional in D1 Basketball. If you plan on being successful at least.

 

[MT01]

When we were winning this game, everyone liked Nick's style of play. When we lost, the world was ending.

Personally I think it was lack of talent on the team. We went ice cold and looked confused. Hopefully, everyone, including Nick can learn and grow.

Nope. Didn't put it here but did on the C-USA board at halftime...

Led the whole first half but the lead feels precarious. Shot nearly 60% in the first half. Won’t shoot like that for an entire game.

Before the game I said this...
Belmont probably wins by double digits - thinking 15 to 20 point win.

So, perhaps I have a little better sense about this than some of you sunshine pumpers? Perhaps?? And look I'm not saying anything about future years. I'm saying this is going to be a long hard year and people keep trying to get this team to .500. It simply isn't going to happen. Not with our non-conference schedule. After Charleston Southern (if we can pull that one out) we likely aren't going to win another non-conf game on our schedule. We certainly won't be favored in any of them. Plus, C-USA is improved. There just aren't a lot of wins we can find on the schedule to pencil in. If we get to 10 wins that will be a success IMO. I see seven. Maybe nine at the most.

 

[MT01]

One thing that is interesting though about this team is that the guys that are assembled certainly have a lot of talent. The problem is we don't have a lot of them. Depth is going to be a big, big issue. I think we are going to see a lot of games like the Belmont game where we look good in the first half and then wear down in the second half. We are going to lose a lot of games on the back end simply because of lack of depth and experience. It is going to be infuriating to watch us lose so many games late, but that's likely how the 18-19 team is going to be defined. You just can't do anything about our depth and experience issues. It is what it is. And both of those will most often rear in the second half.

You can make up for bad nights, depth issues, and experience by playing defense. But McDevitt doesn't seem slightly interested in defense. We knew that when he was hired and we looked at his teams at Asheville. Not exactly a defensive juggernaut. And McDevitt isn't exactly a defensive guru. If McDevitt would adjust his style to his players we could win more than 7 to 9, but he gave us an early glimpse of that against Belmont that he simply isn't going to do that. Not unusual for younger coaches to believe in their system and their style of play. It's happening in Bowling Green right now with the football coach. Veteran coaches like Byrd and Kermit learned how to adapt. Case in point Kermit loves the 1-3-1. But last year's team wasn't as good at it as some of his previous teams. So, he played more man and more traditional zone than he did in previous years. That was Kermit adapting to his team. Not the other way around. Eventually they got good enough to recruit players to their system, but only the best coaches can adapt to the team they have and adjust their philosophy and style to win games. That is not McDevitt right now.

 

[Blueraider_Mike]

I am simply amazed at the JUDGEMENT in this thread. Take a freaking chill pill. Its one freaking game against an opponent that has an experienced coach Byrd with a system that has been in place at one school since 1986...that is over 30 years. I looked up his early record in NCAA games, it wasn't sterling. It took Byrd 7 years to be a consistent winner. We gave Davis 10 years and 3 games in.

While we had some success, we really haven't arrived or had true break through seasons, we one 2 first round NCAA games in the last 20 years. Have you guys forgotten all the ugly losses in CKD tenure?

My eyes are wide open, I am no expectations this year. Belmont has dominated the series, hopefully CNM will turn that around, CKD didn't. What is see is a team with a lot of young guards. I look forward to watching them learn and grow.

 

[MT01]

WTF are you talking about Mike? I think we are allowed to talk about the game and what we think will play out. Maybe you need to take a chill?

 

[Blueraider_Mike]

WTF are you talking about Mike? I think we are allowed to talk about the game and what we think will play out. Maybe you need to take a chill?

I wasn't talking directly to you, if I was, I would have replied to your comment. My post was general in nature.

But I will address you...you say things like CNM is slightly interested in D - really? Do you not recall the game against us in Alaska, did we not win that game only scoring 54 points...and CKD was so impressed he recommended CNM to our AD when the time comes...

Heck, maybe I do need a chill pill...its simple gets old listening to all the negative nellies on the board. Maybe I do need a break.

 

[MT01]

Actually it was 63 points.

And the comment about his defenses was predicated on several years of data not just one game. What was that you were saying about not judging just off one game? Remember when we all looked at his defense efficiency record when he looked like the hire?

 

[abarnett]

We all agree it will b a long season. .500 at best. Let’s give nick a chance he’s lost1 game He was successful at Asheville beating some playing power 5 teams and playing many others close. 500 was probably the best Kermit was going to do even before we lost recruits and exodus of players. This schedule is brutal. Goblueraiders

 

[MT01]

I think .500 happens if Antwan would not have gotten kicked off the team. He would have killed it in this system. And we would have had another elite guard. IMO, losing him was the biggest loss of the off season.

 

[kingaling42]

It was fools gold though. We were shooting 60%. That's not going to consistently happen, thus it's not a sustainable and reliable way to try and win games.

I think it was a combination of things.

1. Lack of talent

2. Lack of depth

3. Coach in his first year with a bunch of new players

4. Lack of discipline on defense

The first 3 I mentioned I can give Nick a pass on because it's his first year. At some point we've gotta be more disciplined and play some defense though. I don't believe it's a coincidence that his former school, UNCA, got torched 100-49 by NC State tonight which is just unacceptable. They're in a similar situation with a depleted roster and new coaches, but those are all his old players and I strongly suspect they're running systems very similar to what Nick ran.

Defense is not optional in college basketball. It's just not. Kansas, Duke, and the blue bloods can sometimes afford to get into those high scoring shoot-outs and play lackadasical defense but that's because they are all 5* talent and CAN typically pour in the points regardless. We simply are not good enough, and never will be good enough, to just thumb our noses at defense. There will be many nights where we struggle to put the ball in the basket. Gotta be able to D up the opponent and limit turnovers. I don't feel we even played good D against the Division 2 opponents. Gonna be a long season.

Wiley- stick to your knowledge base.. all CNM's old players? Of the 4 returning players only Seegars started 5 whole games early in the year last season as a freshman and didn't play but 4 minutes after Jan 1st.. Gilmore was a limited role player, Jones redshirted, and Peck barely sniffed the court.. NC State has one of their best defensive teams in recent years and the UNCA is playing with one of the youngest rosters in the country.. and BTW they're playing a totally different defensive and offensive style under Morrell...

The bigger point however, is that bringing up UNCA's current roster/results under a new coach to implicate CNM defensive abilities is the same as saying that defensive minded CKD is responsible for MTSU's defensive woes... that doesn't make any sense. But if it does to you- shouldn't you be mad at Kermit- this is after all his former roster right?