Let's have an honest discussion on NIL and the portal

[Matt Dossett]

Figured I would get a discussion fired up. What are your overall thoughts on name/image/likeness and the portal as a whole?

I think there are different schools of thought, especially with the portal....

You could argue that coaches can willy nilly go and come as they please, so why not the athletes?

I think that guard rails need to be put in place. I personally believe that a guy SHOULD be able to explore greener pastures ONE TIME WITH A PASS. After that idk. Just don't like the free agency feel with guys changing schools each season.

Switching gears, what do you think about NIL? Do you agree as is? Love it? Hate it? Should there be cap? No cap?

 

[MT Glenn]

For starters, we should stop calling it NIL and call it what it really is: a salary. I personally hate it that the teams with the highest salaries have made it impossible for the smaller programs to keep up.

I like the transfer portal but there should be a limit to how often someone can transfer.

 

[Matt Dossett]

For starters, we should stop calling it NIL and call it what it really is: a salary. I personally hate it that the teams with the highest salaries have made it impossible for the smaller programs to keep up.

I like the transfer portal but there should be a limit to how often someone can transfer.

Agreed. I say one transfer. I could meet you halfway and say sit out a year after that

 

[MidTennMtneer]

None of us have any issue with true NIL. There is zero reason Vatiatto can't do a commercial for The Boulevard. Blocking that has always been stupid.
Revenue sharing is ridiculous, but, I get why the athletes are going after it. The NCAA should've fixed this mess a decade ago. Now it is too late.

I truly feel there should be a CBA to protect the schools (buyouts for transfers), and the players (no shady "NIL" deals). There should be limitations. I have issues with them getting paid AND getting a scholarship, but that won't change.
There also should be a salary minimum and cap. Just like the NFL. The spending has to be reigned in.

A CBA would also help with transfers. I have zero issues with grad transfers. But I think there should be a choice. Either you get a scholarship and can only have one transfer, or you pay your own way and can have unlimited transfers.

All this could still change as the judge yesterday wasn't happy with a few things and mentioned specifically the NCAA is an opt-in organization. Just more ammo for a split off.

 

[sWiley]

It doesn't matter what any of us think or want. It is 100% controlled by the courts and they have spoken. These kids can do whatever the hell they please.

 

[MTTim]

1. I dont support NIL. I do agree a student athlete should be paid a small amount per month, in addition to a scholarship, to help cover expenses. This amount should be capped and the same for all D1 universities.
2. Limit of one transfer without sitting out a year.
3. Coaches are employed by the university and have their own set of guidelines to live by. Student athletes cannot be compared to coach/staff positions. Coaches should be able to leave as long as they abide by their contract.

I'm like Wiley. I pay more attention to the pros now because college athletics is so screwed up. At this rate, in two years I'll have zero interest in anything college related. Sad.

 

[DisgruntledAlum]

I'm getting to the point that I don't care anymore. The administration doesn't care, the landscape is a mess, what is the point?

 

[ewglenn]

If I were in charge and had complete control I would make the transfer limited to 1 free transfer and after that you have to sit for a year. Unless the athlete is a graduate transfer then they are allowed another free transfer.

For NIL, I would make them contractual. If the player leaves early or has academic or eligibility issues they are required to pay back a prorated amount. Put clauses into those contracts that if a school signs a player to a bigger NIL deal they must pay the prior school a 10% transfer fee. That money could be used by the prior school for their NIL funds. For example, if Bama took an MTSU player and paid him 1 million per year for 3 years then MTSU would be paid 100k for 3 years.

 

[DisgruntledAlum]

I'd like to think that at some point, schools and boosters are going to get tired of paying some of these kids that end up being a giant bust on and off the field and get some sense of paying them for their productivity on the field. Maybe toss in incentives for graduating and staying out of trouble. Or, if they get in trouble or become academic ineligible, there is a fine for them.

I doubt something like that will happen before my field of F's is empty or I am dead, and I'm only 52.

 

[Matt Dossett]

It doesn't matter what any of us think or want. It is 100% controlled by the courts and they have spoken. These kids can do whatever the hell they please.

I guess you could say whatever is on here "doesn't matter." I created this for sake of discussion...

 

[DisgruntledAlum]

I guess you could say whatever is on here "doesn't matter." I created this for sake of discussion...

Everyone is frustrated... Why doesn't our school have the same values of excellence that they claim to instill in all of us?

 

[RaiderDoug]

If I were in charge and had complete control I would make the transfer limited to 1 free transfer and after that you have to sit for a year. Unless the athlete is a graduate transfer then they are allowed another free transfer.

For NIL, I would make them contractual. If the player leaves early or has academic or eligibility issues they are required to pay back a prorated amount. Put clauses into those contracts that if a school signs a player to a bigger NIL deal they must pay the prior school a 10% transfer fee. That money could be used by the prior school for their NIL funds. For example, if Bama took an MTSU player and paid him 1 million per year for 3 years then MTSU would be paid 100k for 3 years.

I agree with both of these. The 1-time transfer thing is never going to happen though.

I've no issue with NIL.. I always thought it was dumb that a player couldn't stump for the local burger joint or sell some of his stuff on Ebay.

I do think we need some contractually binding NIL deals to prevent the insanity that's happening.

I'd eventually like to see somewhat of a soccer model. If MT signs a kid to say, a 3 year NIL deal, but he blows up after 1 year and wants to go play at Alabama, that's fine - but Alabama (or the kid) has to buy out the remaining 2 years of the NIL contract. Everyone wins - the kid gets to move up and get bigger NIL money from Bama, Bama gets a player they want, and MT would get to reinvest that $$$$'s in other players or such. And if a player is determined to leave, that's fine - he can go anytime he wants, but MT retains the NIL rights, so that's at least provides some pause to the every player a free agent every year chaos.

I think this will eventually happen - this transfer portal nonsense is burning even the big boys - even UT had to scramble a bit to keep their QB and WR this year who essentially threatened to walk if they didn't renegotiate. At some point, schools are going to protect themselves.

 

[MidTennMtneer]

It was announced this week that JT Toppin is staying at TX Tech and not heading to NBA. Why? A $4m deal.
That freshman at BYU, $5m.
The Big East is excited because they will be pouring the same $20m into rev sharing as the SEC, but where the SEC only has around $8m for a MBB roster, the Big East can have $12-14m.

That isn't sustainable with zero protection for those who give all that money. Eventually the donors will say enough is enough.

 

[AustinLewis]

Figured I would get a discussion fired up. What are your overall thoughts on name/image/likeness and the portal as a whole?

I think there are different schools of thought, especially with the portal....

You could argue that coaches can willy nilly go and come as they please, so why not the athletes?

I think that guard rails need to be put in place. I personally believe that a guy SHOULD be able to explore greener pastures ONE TIME WITH A PASS. After that idk. Just don't like the free agency feel with guys changing schools each season.

Switching gears, what do you think about NIL? Do you agree as is? Love it? Hate it? Should there be cap? No cap?

Coaches have contracts. In football coaches, position coaches usually have 1 year deals and coordinators usually have 3 year deals. HC are usually somewhere between 4-6 years. They also have buyouts.

I'm ok with the portal & NIL, but it's the Wild West right now. Tampering abounds. Handshake deals.

At some point, you'll need to do 1, 2, 3, and 4 year deals with buyouts unless :
1) Coaching change
2) Graduation

I can also see a transfer fee (like pro soccer).

 

[DisgruntledAlum]

I don't mind a kid making commercials and such, but demanding millions when not played a snap yet is ridiculous.

I think there should be a cap based on years of experience. Give 1- & 2-year guys like a rookie contract. Remember when NFL rookies were making more than established veterans and then they revolted, and rookie deals began?

Everyone is too eager to sue as well. The guy from Villanova suing now because he was not allowed to profit from NIL, and his last year was like 2016 or so. I keep hoping a court will say the rules back then were the rules, case dismissed.

 

[DisgruntledAlum]

Just a matter of time before a coach tells a kid to hit the road because he sucks and isn't worth NIL money and they feel it can be utilized better on a different player.

Honestly, I wouldn't be surprised to see players changing teams in mid-season in next 20 years.

 

[MidTennMtneer]

Just a matter of time before a coach tells a kid to hit the road because he sucks and isn't worth NIL money and they feel it can be utilized better on a different player.

Honestly, I wouldn't be surprised to see players changing teams in mid-season in next 20 years.

View embedded media

Best for the "student athlete" my foot. I don't care what they say, they are contracted employees. In ANY other line of work that is exactly what they would be.

 

[MidTennMtneer]

🤣

 

[RaiderDoug]

Just a matter of time before a coach tells a kid to hit the road because he sucks and isn't worth NIL money and they feel it can be utilized better on a different player.

Honestly, I wouldn't be surprised to see players changing teams in mid-season in next 20 years.

View embedded media

They should, but there's a lot of moving parts.

NIL is funded by boosters and fans, but if you give, give, give...and your favorite player walks anyway, how much more are you going to give?

And ultimately, coaches are paid to win, fans only pay if you win - so if coach/program tells a mercenary player to hit the skids, then he better have a backup plan.

Another thought, NIL is name/image/likeness - but if X player is so unlikeable due to all the hostage holding, how much is NIL really worth. Is it even NIL at that point? Was it ever?

Tennessee is a a test case for a-lot of what's happening. About a month ago, they just had a corner "reopen" his NIL negotiations because the opposite corner popped his knee and he saw that he had more leverage. They just renegotiated in January a new NIL deal with this same QB and now he wants more (and he hasn't been really good on the field anyway). The contract is literally worth nothing from a binding standpoint, and can be re-opened every day in theory.

 

[DisgruntledAlum]

They should, but there's a lot of moving parts.

NIL is funded by boosters and fans, but if you give, give, give...and your favorite player walks anyway, how much more are you going to give?

And ultimately, coaches are paid to win, fans only pay if you win - so if coach/program tells a mercenary player to hit the skids, then he better have a backup plan.

Another thought, NIL is name/image/likeness - but if X player is so unlikeable due to all the hostage holding, how much is NIL really worth. Is it even NIL at that point? Was it ever?

Tennessee is a a test case for a-lot of what's happening. About a month ago, they just had a corner "reopen" his NIL negotiations because the opposite corner popped his knee and he saw that he had more leverage. They just renegotiated in January a new NIL deal with this same QB and now he wants more (and he hasn't been really good on the field anyway). The contract is literally worth nothing from a binding standpoint, and can be re-opened every day in theory.

I didn't realize they just renegotiated with the QB in January... That's crazy...

 

[FranklinRaider315]

Haggerty is now shopping the portal/ NIL he got from Memphis last season and rumored to be jumping for a price of up to $3MM. This is completely out of control.

 

[MidTennMtneer]

I mean.....really?! Why even do scholarships at this point.

 

[MidTennMtneer]

Just a matter of time before a coach tells a kid to hit the road because he sucks and isn't worth NIL money and they feel it can be utilized better on a different player.

Honestly, I wouldn't be surprised to see players changing teams in mid-season in next 20 years.

View embedded media

I can't believe I'm saying this regarding UT, but kudos to them not backing down and shipping Nico off.

I'd like to say this will be an impetus for change, but not holding my breath.

 

[DisgruntledAlum]

I can't believe I'm saying this regarding UT, but kudos to them not backing down and shipping Nico off.

I'd like to say this will be an impetus for change, but not holding my breath.

I agree, as much as it pains me... I have to give a tip of the hat to UT on this one, but that is where it ends. lol

 

[DisgruntledAlum]

If I am reading this right, the state of New Mexico is going to start giving UNM and NMSU $2.5M for NIL.

 

[DisgruntledAlum]

Two more lawsuits for some extra eligibility...

 

[MidTennMtneer]

Two more lawsuits for some extra eligibility...

View embedded media

And they'll win because limiting their eligibility without their voice is an anti-trust violation. I still don't get how as the schools elect to be a NCAA member, and the athletes elect to be an NCAA student, but I'm no lawyer. Time after time the courts have gone against the NCAA.

There are many avenues to fix this, I just hope it can be.

 

[Sommy]

It’s funny to me that 5-10 years ago, the argument was for the athlete that just wanted to coach a camp over the summer or get a part time job. It made sense. Then it immediately went to, guys transferring every single year, threatening to quit during the playoffs and demanding $4M a year. How terrible it’s turned into this. There had to be a happy medium. Transfer should be 1 time and then sit out to slow it down.

It’s also ironic in today’s world where diversity and equal opportunities have become much more of a focus, but with college athletics it’s VERY quickly turning into about 7-8 teams with an opportunity to consolidate all the resources and the rest of the 100+ schools can’t even dream of a chance or opportunity to compete. Look at the difference in revenues of MT to even Vandy. Where is the equality wokesters? Everything has funneled upwards to just the elite [resourced] programs. Does nobody care about equal opportunity in sports?

 

[sWiley]

Where is the equality wokesters? Everything has funneled upwards to just the elite [resourced] programs. Does nobody care about equal opportunity in sports?

Sports mirror life.

Look at the insanely growing wealth inequality gap and how much richer those with assets have become vs. those without assets just in the last 5 years. Simply put, asset owners saw their assets go up 30-50% (100%+ for fine art) while simultaneously the working poor with no assets got zero equity increases and instead got to see their rent rise 40%. Let's recap. Homeowners get 40% equity and their house payment stays mostly the same, and non-asset owners get no equity and a 40% increase in rent. HMMMMMM??????? I'm honestly surprised the country didn't lose it's mind over this, but I guess there's a lot of homeowners who are happy about it all and the non-asset owners are mostly not smart enough to connect the dots....what a shame. Rich get richer (and control everything) and the poor get poorer. Same thing happening in college sports. We are the poor, and blue bloods are Elon Musk et al.

They've got everyone divided and fighting and focused on emotional hot button topics (guns, immigration, gay marriage, left vs. right, bathrooms, etc) while they pick everyone's pockets clean, especially the non-asset holders. Basically the same thing happening in sports, all the money and best players flowing to the top, while the powers that be continue to run the show and tell everyone everything is okay while they hoard nearly all of the resources.

People will eventually wake up once the standard of living for non-asset holders and the working poor has gotten so bad, but it may take a while (and will be too late). People are far too comfortable in this country and the rich figured that out with covid. The "riot tax" isn't nearly as much as it used to be so it's time to steal more for the asset holders. For college sports, it'll never change for the better for a school like us. We are just slowly over time minimized by the powers that be. Currently masquerading as a "D1" program that's a glorified JUCO.

Anyway, this relates to college sports because nobody really cares anymore. As long as the ultra rich are taken care of, in this case the blue bloods of college sports, then all is right in the world. It's remarkable how good of a job they do convincing everyone of this.

 

[MidTennMtneer]

....
Anyway, this relates to college sports because nobody really cares anymore. As long as the ultra rich are taken care of, in this case the blue bloods of college sports, then all is right in the world. It's remarkable how good of a job they do convincing everyone of this.

THIS right here. ESPN is 100000% guilty of this. The media created the whole BCS conference mess and then P5 v G5 Autonomy. Now the Power schools have created the new clearing house, College Sports Commission LLC, that eventually will work to separate even more. ESPN supports the CFP which separates things too, etc.

The separation of the haves and have nots is growing more every season. Both in college athletics and life.

 

[DisgruntledAlum]

Call me crazy, but Tennessee could have just saved college football, to a point.

I mean, I am hoping they taught everyone else that it is ok to say no and they are not obligated to buckle to every dad and agent's demand. Also, I am hoping this just may level everything out over the coming years. The kids right now will definitely benefit more than ones say 5-10 years down the road. Maybe we are in the middle of a correction, sort of say.

Can always hope at least...

 

[ewglenn]

Call me crazy, but Tennessee could have just saved college football, to a point.

I mean, I am hoping they taught everyone else that it is ok to say no and they are not obligated to buckle to every dad and agent's demand. Also, I am hoping this just may level everything out over the coming years. The kids right now will definitely benefit more than ones say 5-10 years down the road. Maybe we are in the middle of a correction, sort of say.

Can always hope at least...

Tennessee was one of the first major NIL deals for a high school recruit when they signed Nico to a 4 year 8 mil deal. I don’t think we can really praise one of the universities that essentially caused a lot of this mess lol.

 

[RaiderDoug]

Call me crazy, but Tennessee could have just saved college football, to a point.

I mean, I am hoping they taught everyone else that it is ok to say no and they are not obligated to buckle to every dad and agent's demand. Also, I am hoping this just may level everything out over the coming years. The kids right now will definitely benefit more than ones say 5-10 years down the road. Maybe we are in the middle of a correction, sort of say.

Can always hope at least...

This probably happens a lot more than we know - it's just that it's handled by professionals rather than the Iamaleava clown crew and it all gets settled out outside of the public eye.

The post-mortem on this gets better by the day. They renegotiated back in December and got a raise from 2 to 2.4 mil, but the "agent" who's not a real agent went shopping Nico around this spring without the family knowledge, Oregon was called and Dan Lanning said "hell with this" and called Tennessee. At that point, it got into the media, and the Dad called the agent who told him he had a deal (which he didn't) and that Tennessee would cave and convinced the Dad to go along with it. Nico had no idea any of this was going on until he got a call on Friday morning from Pops telling him not to go to practice. Nico, by all accounts, is just a nice kid who is not the most headstrong - well, he just goes along with it. That's when Tennessee told him GFY.

Anyhow, nothing is going to save college football from this. Not the NCAA - they've essentially given up on policing football, not the House Settlement which doesn't affect outside NIL, not collective bargaining as there is no incentive for players to unionize, not the courts (they side with the players in all disputes) or congress (congress ain't going to bat for the little folks) and certainly not the schools or players or conferences which will require concerted action and effort and they will always act as individuals looking out for #1.

It will eventually collapse under its own weight. Every year another program is going to find itself getting left so far behind that they're going to say "hey, there's got to be a better way". Right now, it's us G5 dregs. In a few years though, it will be the Mississippi State's, Purdue's, and Pittsburgh's......

I think within 10 years we have a super league for the 30 or so mega-$$$ programs, and a more traditional college football league which will be for everyone else.

Until then, we're all along for the ride.

 

[DisgruntledAlum]

Tennessee was one of the first major NIL deals for a high school recruit when they signed Nico to a 4 year 8 mil deal. I don’t think we can really praise one of the universities that essentially caused a lot of this mess lol.

Even prisoners say they repent after doing wrong.

 

[DisgruntledAlum]

This probably happens a lot more than we know - it's just that it's handled by professionals rather than the Iamaleava clown crew and it all gets settled out outside of the public eye.

The post-mortem on this gets better by the day. They renegotiated back in December and got a raise from 2 to 2.4 mil, but the "agent" who's not a real agent went shopping Nico around this spring without the family knowledge, Oregon was called and Dan Lanning said "hell with this" and called Tennessee. At that point, it got into the media, and the Dad called the agent who told him he had a deal (which he didn't) and that Tennessee would cave and convinced the Dad to go along with it. Nico had no idea any of this was going on until he got a call on Friday morning from Pops telling him not to go to practice. Nico, by all accounts, is just a nice kid who is not the most headstrong - well, he just goes along with it. That's when Tennessee told him GFY.

Anyhow, nothing is going to save college football from this. Not the NCAA - they've essentially given up on policing football, not the House Settlement which doesn't affect outside NIL, not collective bargaining as there is no incentive for players to unionize, not the courts (they side with the players in all disputes) or congress (congress ain't going to bat for the little folks) and certainly not the schools or players or conferences which will require concerted action and effort and they will always act as individuals looking out for #1.

It will eventually collapse under its own weight. Every year another program is going to find itself getting left so far behind that they're going to say "hey, there's got to be a better way". Right now, it's us G5 dregs. In a few years though, it will be the Mississippi State's, Purdue's, and Pittsburgh's......

I think within 10 years we have a super league for the 30 or so mega-$$$ programs, and a more traditional college football league which will be for everyone else.

Until then, we're all along for the ride.

You know, wouldn't it be funny that after a split, and the others drop down like you mentioned, that most fans say to hell with the top programs because of the money and constant threat of portal movement and decide that G5 football is the purest form of the sport and it slowly begins to be the most popular. Sure, the future P2 will have its wealthy fans, and the rest will eventually be priced out and forced to go elsewhere to watch the sport live. That is where the G5 will come in, offering a product at a reasonable price.

At some point, maybe not in my lifetime, but all games will go to a PPV stream if not in person. I say that because these leaders are so damn greedy. Besides, look where NASCAR has gone the last 15-20 years. People will get sick of having to pay all these multiple streaming services just to watch their favorite teams and sports.

Like I said earlier, this very well may not be in my lifetime, or never happen, but it would be funny.

 

[DisgruntledAlum]

Does the Do Not Contact tag mean a team cannot contact, I'd rather you not at this moment, or don't call us, we'll call you?

 

[RaiderDoug]

Does the Do Not Contact tag mean a team cannot contact, I'd rather you not at this moment, or don't call us, we'll call you?

View embedded media

There's a debate about that.

Does it mean do not contact Nico?

Or does it mean do not contact his reps?

Because his handlers absolutely do not want Nico involved in any of this.

You know, wouldn't it be funny that after a split, and the others drop down like you mentioned, that most fans say to hell with the top programs because of the money and constant threat of portal movement and decide that G5 football is the purest form of the sport and it slowly begins to be the most popular. Sure, the future P2 will have its wealthy fans, and the rest will eventually be priced out and forced to go elsewhere to watch the sport live. That is where the G5 will come in, offering a product at a reasonable price.

At some point, maybe not in my lifetime, but all games will go to a PPV stream if not in person. I say that because these leaders are so damn greedy. Besides, look where NASCAR has gone the last 15-20 years. People will get sick of having to pay all these multiple streaming services just to watch their favorite teams and sports.

Like I said earlier, this very well may not be in my lifetime, or never happen, but it would be funny.

I think it could happen. It's eventually going to be like an NFL-lite. The NFL is all but cost-prohibitive for a family these days other than 1 game here or there. I think the mega-football programs eventually get to that point. Now, you put Alabama vs Ohio State on a Saturday at 3:30, and the whole nation is going to watch. But I also think a lot of folks are going to gravitate towards more accessible college football.

Especially if whatever the leftovers manage to form has a compelling product - i.e. top 25, playoffs, traditional rivalries, etc, etc.

 

[ewglenn]

My understanding is it means no contact with him or his representatives unless they reach out first.

 

[RaiderDoug]

My understanding is it means no contact with him or his representatives unless they reach out first.

Looks like he landed at UCLA.

The dumbass family says it's because of the Tennessee offense and that they didn't add enough talent around him, and not about money.

So he goes to UCLA, with an OC who's never called plays before and a new offense, and not a hint of talent at WR or OL around him. Yeah, right.

 

[DisgruntledAlum]

Looks like he landed at UCLA.

The dumbass family says it's because of the Tennessee offense and that they didn't add enough talent around him, and not about money.

So he goes to UCLA, with an OC who's never called plays before and a new offense, and not a hint of talent at WR or OL around him. Yeah, right.

I heard they offered him $1M with a take it or leave it.

I've not read anything specifically on money amount.