I am seeing a lot of complaints about it. Granted they didn't work so complaints are warranted I guess but I am curious about the specific complaints. It seems to me the coaches did what we have begged them to do and went less conservative. It almost cost us but I am surprised to see the complaints. With 4:30 left we get the ball to put the game a way. We pass the ball 2 of the three plays. The weren't screens either. The announcers were baffled. I was surprised but it was what the fans clamored for. The drive before that we threw the ball and were going for it on fourth if not for a penalty. I guess I just feel like we got what wanted.
Play calling at the end
- Thread starter TeKEraider
- Start date
What we are clamoring for is situation football...its OK to pass, but there are much safer plays to run then 20 yard fly patterns. BS was 1 0f 6 in the 4th Q. These were not wise calls, they were attempts to hit big plays. How about a slant, or a dump to a TE. Or some variety in the run game.
We had multiple drives in the 4th Q...
3 plays 1:27 time
5 plays 2:28
3 plays 52 seconds
3 plays 42 seconds
In all fairness, the field position was not good. But we only got one first down the entire 4th Q. Maybe it was Marshall just playing good D. But some of it has to be on us...we had a 10 point lead - run some dang clock off.
Interesting stat, our longest drive of the entire game was 3:37.
Maybe the issue is the style of play is not built for winning close games or holding on to leads.
What do you think?
In our last two possessions, according to the Marshall news, we ran a grand total of 77 seconds off the clock without them running out of timeouts. Whether it's coaching or execution, that has to be better.
I think I didn't see a bunch of 20 yard flys. I saw about a 15 yrd back shoulder throw to Batties that we have completed dozens of times, a 20 yd jump on 3rd and long that could/should have been a PI and a comeback route of about 12 yds that was batted. I also have no clue what his reads were so maybe we ran the routes you mentioned and they weren't there. Now we can question the 3rd and 9 run on the last possession but consider the time and time out situation and the fact Brent was 0-fer the last two possessions I don't know that I fault it.
I also think we got more than one first down. The drive prior we went from our 10 to the Marshall 34. I am of the thought that we should have ran the ball and the clock. I may not have like the result of the pass plays chosen but can you imagine the melt down if we had ran a wr screen.
I am not defending the staff. I think we have to protect a 10 point lead. I just find it interesting that we were more aggressive, including looking like we were going for it on 4th prior to a penalty, and lots of folks act like this is the same ole same ole. That's all.
I think our final regulation possession was handled poorly. The staff was absolutely correct to be concerned about potentially having to punt back to Marshall, given that Marshall still had 2 timeouts remaining at the beginning of our possession and our punting game is not consistently reliable. We chose to run on first down and got nothing, and then proceeded to try to straddle the line between running some clock and still playing fast enough to keep alive the opportunity for us to move the ball and win in regulation. On that last series, I think we would have been better off to go with this approach:
1st down: This is the play where you take a calculated shot with a high percentage passing play that you are confident you can complete. If you get a pass completion for more than 5 yards, then you go all in to try to move the ball and play fast. If you throw an incompletion, then you move on to ...
2nd down: After the incompletion stops the clock and you are looking at 2nd-and-10 with 1 minute remaining, you go with a running play on 2nd down. If you break it open and get a first down, then you are back into aggressive mode. If the running play goes nowhere, you run the clock down and dare Marshall to call its timeout. That puts the pressure on the Marshall staff, knowing that if they call a timeout they may inadvertently help the Raiders if they were able to convert a 3rd down play. I bet a majority of head coaches would not call a timeout in that defensive situation.
3rd down: You run the ball again with probably less than 20 seconds on the clock. Marshall would use a timeout and you punt it with roughly 15 seconds remaining. Marshall would then have enough time for just one play most likely.
If Marshall rolled the dice and called a timeout after the 2nd down play, then I think you go with a run-pass option play on third down, with instructions to the QB that he does not throw a pass unless he is supremely confident in a completion.
It was a tough situation and there are arguments that can be made for multiple play-calling approaches in the scenario that we were in, but I did not like the 1st down run call. I think you go with calculated aggression on first down there, and then dial it back on the following downs if unsuccessful on first down.
The trick play at the end of the first half was also ill-timed in my opinion. We were out of timeouts with less than 20 seconds on the clock. There is no way we would go with a running play there and the defense knows it, but the trick play starts with a handoff going toward Grammer's side. It was obvious what call was on and that's why the Marshall secondary didn't take the bait. I have no problem with that play in and of itself, but that was not the time for it IMO.
Even with saying all of this, I am very happy we got the win and I concede that all members of the MT staff have forgotten more football than I will ever know.
1st down: This is the play where you take a calculated shot with a high percentage passing play that you are confident you can complete. If you get a pass completion for more than 5 yards, then you go all in to try to move the ball and play fast. If you throw an incompletion, then you move on to ...
2nd down: After the incompletion stops the clock and you are looking at 2nd-and-10 with 1 minute remaining, you go with a running play on 2nd down. If you break it open and get a first down, then you are back into aggressive mode. If the running play goes nowhere, you run the clock down and dare Marshall to call its timeout. That puts the pressure on the Marshall staff, knowing that if they call a timeout they may inadvertently help the Raiders if they were able to convert a 3rd down play. I bet a majority of head coaches would not call a timeout in that defensive situation.
3rd down: You run the ball again with probably less than 20 seconds on the clock. Marshall would use a timeout and you punt it with roughly 15 seconds remaining. Marshall would then have enough time for just one play most likely.
If Marshall rolled the dice and called a timeout after the 2nd down play, then I think you go with a run-pass option play on third down, with instructions to the QB that he does not throw a pass unless he is supremely confident in a completion.
It was a tough situation and there are arguments that can be made for multiple play-calling approaches in the scenario that we were in, but I did not like the 1st down run call. I think you go with calculated aggression on first down there, and then dial it back on the following downs if unsuccessful on first down.
The trick play at the end of the first half was also ill-timed in my opinion. We were out of timeouts with less than 20 seconds on the clock. There is no way we would go with a running play there and the defense knows it, but the trick play starts with a handoff going toward Grammer's side. It was obvious what call was on and that's why the Marshall secondary didn't take the bait. I have no problem with that play in and of itself, but that was not the time for it IMO.
Even with saying all of this, I am very happy we got the win and I concede that all members of the MT staff have forgotten more football than I will ever know.
Fans get pissed because the plays failed, and you never hear the complaints when they work. Marshall was stacking the box and MT was playing for the first down and to keep the ball moving. I would have ran some kind of crossing route with the stacked receiver set since Marshall was playing man cover one (free safety drops back everyone else plays man), but the plays called weren't horrible. They should have worked (the passing plays). They got their butts burned running man in OT 1 on that pass to Batties.
Offensive calls are made based off what the defense is giving you. Although we did hike the ball.with 12 seconds left on the play clock towards the end of the game. Not a fan of that.
Offensive calls are made based off what the defense is giving you. Although we did hike the ball.with 12 seconds left on the play clock towards the end of the game. Not a fan of that.
I really didn't intend for my post to come across as coach bashing. I thought there were some very good things done by the coaches in the game also. The option wrinkle to the run game with Richie James worked very well. I also liked the quick kick punt by Brent Stockstill to help win a field position battle late in the game. I also agreed with the call to kick the short field goal to go up 17-7. Some in my section were grumbling about not going for a touchdown there.
My primary concerns with game management were simply the two items I mentioned originally. The trick play we ran is a fine play; there was just no way it was going to work in the situation that we ran it in unless the defensive secondary completely lost its mind. Given that we were out of timeouts at the end of the half, I would have been content with a conservative approach and a field goal attempt.
At the end of the day, we won the game and I hope we can keep winning!
Randall my post was more towards the topic than just your post, so I didn't take it as coach bashing. You could get a group of twenty coaches in a room and likely none of them will have the exact same strategy. You had a good post, and I don't remember the time remaining when Marshall was making their come back but a run play on all the three and outs may had worked in running more time off the clock than what it did playing for the first down. But to be honest I probably would have played for the first down too considering the momentum Marshall had and them crowding the box.
Aside from the trick play and really the last 2 drives of the 4th Q, the play calling was good.
A couple of thoughts - they need to play Grammar much more at WR...this way the trick play is not expected. I felt like in the FIU game he had 8-10 plays at WR, with a couple of catches. I think you could also line him up more in the back field and use the option game like they did with James. This could be a throw/run option with AG. Imagine a pitch to AG, with our Big WR releasing out - this could be a play run 4-6 times per game. With our RBs out, Grammar is one of our better athletes - get the best players on the field more.
We really need the passing game to set up our run game. In previous years, it was the opposite.
As you know I am not a real coach, just playing one on the message board.
A couple of thoughts - they need to play Grammar much more at WR...this way the trick play is not expected. I felt like in the FIU game he had 8-10 plays at WR, with a couple of catches. I think you could also line him up more in the back field and use the option game like they did with James. This could be a throw/run option with AG. Imagine a pitch to AG, with our Big WR releasing out - this could be a play run 4-6 times per game. With our RBs out, Grammar is one of our better athletes - get the best players on the field more.
We really need the passing game to set up our run game. In previous years, it was the opposite.
As you know I am not a real coach, just playing one on the message board.
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