UNIVERSITY NEWS Middle Tennessee Boulevard opens (mostly) March 6
- Thread starter SpaceRaider
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So we built the Pentagon in 1941 in 3 months but it took over 3 years to "almost" complete one mile of Middle Tennessee Blvd.
To be fair though, we had the greatest generation building the Pentagon.
Well the Department of War (I think that was the name then for the DoD) didn't have the four or five government bureaucracies with their fingers in it like Middle Tennessee Blvd. It's maddening that we were hearing in 2003 that this was going to be started and complete in a couple of years. We even relocated tailgating from where we did it back then in anticipation of the project.
[QUOTE="SpaceRaider, post: 96398, member: 20" It's maddening that we were hearing in 2003 that this was going to be started and complete in a couple of years. We even relocated tailgating from where we did it back then in anticipation of the project.[/QUOTE]
And, just think newborn infants and toddler children of 2003 are now old enough for a Tennessee Learners Permit (or graduated license) to drive said Middle Tennessee Boulevard and/or possibly be freshmen at our fair university if they were then at the “terrible twos” stage. Took an entire generation childhood lifespan to get done. At least it was better than “Bridge over Broad” or “Blue Raider Bridge”—which took approximately 45 years from original proposal (roughly era of I-24 opening to 2018) for final surfacing.
And, just think newborn infants and toddler children of 2003 are now old enough for a Tennessee Learners Permit (or graduated license) to drive said Middle Tennessee Boulevard and/or possibly be freshmen at our fair university if they were then at the “terrible twos” stage. Took an entire generation childhood lifespan to get done. At least it was better than “Bridge over Broad” or “Blue Raider Bridge”—which took approximately 45 years from original proposal (roughly era of I-24 opening to 2018) for final surfacing.
As someone who has long favored a name change and pretty well given up on it until mcphee is carried out of cope feet first, the plastering of MTxx all over everything on campus really grinds my gears. The post, pylon, column, or whatever you want to call it there at that entrance on Middle Tennessee and Faulkinberry, is like a big 'middle' finger to those of us who want the change. It announces to all who enter or exit from Faulkinberry, this is 'little middle'
As someone who has long favored a name change and pretty well given up on it until mcphee is carried out of cope feet first, the plastering of MTxx all over everything on campus really grinds my gears. The post, pylon, column, or whatever you want to call it there at that entrance on Middle Tennessee and Faulkinberry, is like a big 'middle' finger to those of us who want the change. It announces to all who enter or exit from Faulkinberry, this is 'little middle'
only good thing is those are individual pieces that can be removed.
Don’t really see how the name changing would do anything to make us not “Little Middle.” To the the University of Middle Tennessee or Middle Tennessee State University are the same to me. Performance improves prestige not the name. Memphis removed the State from their name and has there been any improvements other than that?As someone who has long favored a name change and pretty well given up on it until mcphee is carried out of cope feet first, the plastering of MTxx all over everything on campus really grinds my gears. The post, pylon, column, or whatever you want to call it there at that entrance on Middle Tennessee and Faulkinberry, is like a big 'middle' finger to those of us who want the change. It announces to all who enter or exit from Faulkinberry, this is 'little middle'
Brand is everything.
I really don't think Virginia Polytechnic Institute and State University would have gotten them very far, on field accomplishments or not. The media would have made up their own acronym. Multiple. Different networks calling it different names. Just as happens to us. Instead the school took control and the whole country knows them as Virginia Tech.
As we should take control.
That column is the first thing I noticed in the ribbon cutting photos. Glad I wasn't the only one.
Virginia Tech did that huh? Could not be that is what we call tech colleges? Texas Tech, Georgia Tech, Louisiana Tech, etc. Having State in their names does not hurt Boise State, Michigan State, etc. A name change literally does nothing. It does not make us better and it does not change perception.
Prove I am wrong. Did anything change when Memphis went from Memphis State University to the University of Memphis? Serious question.
I’m done trying to educate people on this. I’ve researched and written about this topic more than anyone in the world. But I’m tired of caring. Ask Space.
Time and time again, institutional name changes have fueled institutional growth (North Texas State to North Texas, for example).
Show me a school with a direction AND "state" is considered to be a tier 1 research institution.
I can vouch for this. You have provided ample evidence on the benefits of a change as well as Space.
In a perfect world a name change should have taken place simultaneously with the move to D-1 in FB. Of course, looking back the move to D-1 should have taken place a minimum of a half dozen years earlier.
[crposton: search the archives (hope it's still available) for the well-researched studies on this board showing the positive effects of a name change, it's not all about athletics. Additionally, if a name change wasn't seen as important UNA would still be Florence St., Northeast State Missouri University would not be Truman State, Heck, MT would still be Middle Tennessee State Teachers College (1925) or Middle Tennessee State Normal School (from the founding in 1911).]
[crposton: search the archives (hope it's still available) for the well-researched studies on this board showing the positive effects of a name change, it's not all about athletics. Additionally, if a name change wasn't seen as important UNA would still be Florence St., Northeast State Missouri University would not be Truman State, Heck, MT would still be Middle Tennessee State Teachers College (1925) or Middle Tennessee State Normal School (from the founding in 1911).]
You proved my point. Those colleges did that because it created a unified easy to say brand for them.
As said. Research has been done on the name change. It’s not about “just” the state. It’s having state. Having four words. Being directional. You have TV calling us MTSU. Middle. Middle Tennessee State. Middle Tennessee. And even Tennessee State.
There is zero consistency and that is on the school for not branding properly.
I personally believe nothing should be on campus with MTSU. The academic logo they came up with around 2000 is great. Focuses on Middle Tennessee and leaves the State University to smaller letters. The MT athletic logo is great (minus Pegasus) and I even have a tattoo of it. But that’s the problem. You have those great things then you have a brand new column with MTSU on it.
What is the message supposed to be?
Not at all the same thing and you all know it. Going from Middle Tennessee State Teachers College or Middle Tennessee State Normal School to Middle Tennessee State University is due to being a different type of institution. In this instance we would not be going from a college to a university just moving where the university is in the name. If the name of a school has positive effects on funding for research and athletics we live in a shallow and sad society. To me there is zero difference in calling us Middle Tennessee State University vs. the University of Middle Tennessee.
They call Central Florida that and UCF. They call North Carolina that and UNC. What is your point? The reason why they don't know what to call us is that we do not matter to them. Changing our name is not going to make us matter more to them. If they call us Middle Tennessee, Middle Tennessee State, or MTSU they are all correct.
Making us the University of Middle Tennessee will not make us a tier 1 research institution. Is there an example where a name change caused a school to become a tier 1 research institution?
We aren't going to be Tier 1 anytime soon if the THEC has anything to do with it.
No one is saying a name change will make us a tier 1 academic institution, however, our perception would increase dramatically, thereby increasing by-in and endowments.
MTSU (which I still call it sometimes by the way) = Little Middle to a large population of people.
No one is saying a name change will make us a tier 1 academic institution, however, our perception would increase dramatically, thereby increasing by-in and endowments.
MTSU (which I still call it sometimes by the way) = Little Middle to a large population of people.
There is a school in Ohio called Case Western Reserve University. Compete in Div. III athletics and are a top 50 National University and top research institution in Ohio. To me that name does not scream prestige and yet they are.
Middle Tennessee State University is a state school in the middle of the state. University of Middle Tennessee is THE school for Middle Tennessee. Perception matters. If not when we made the move to D1, we should have made the change during the centennial campaign.
To be fair I think a name change is fine. Does not matter to me one way or another. I just don't think it would have as positive of an impact as many believe. Honest question how many of you that want to see a name change would start giving more money solely because of the name change?
But see that's the problem. You are just basing your view on an opinion. And you are using awful analogies to support your opinion that are just well - awful analogies. I have studied this. To include both my own empirical data along with information gleaned from other universities, interviews with leadership from those institutions, the reasons behind their decisions, what the outcomes were, and how those institutions benefited.
Bottom line is brand matters. Perception matters.
And while a name change alone isn't going to turn MT into Harvard it is a relatively minor step that should have already been taken to move the university out of it's 20th century model its basically still operating in and demonstrate that it is prepared to be an emerging institution of higher learning. But you know what - and if you wanted to argue this then I would probably agree with you - just like the state proved with the f'd law school decision, it probably doesn't matter. This ass backwards state is never going to let MT spread its wings. Has to be one of the few states in the nation that intentionally undermines its own institutions because these ass hat political clowns in the state think that MT or Tenn Tech having something is somehow going to hurt UT - and they don't even realize they are hurting their own state.
If someone asked me 10, 15, or 25 years ago if we needed a name change, I would have likely said MTSU name felt the same as UCLA and we don’t need to change for the sake of change. I have a different point of view today mainly for the sake of consistent branding in changing our name.
However, we are approaching 20 years into the 21st century and we have students matriculating college who wasn’t alive in the 1900s or much less remember who we were in 90s, 80s, or 70s and we must improve branding to gain researchers, professors, and students to be a Tier 1 University. That’s what it’s all about as an institution: having terminal degrees, professional disciplines, and primary research. That is where money is and powerful “cheerleaders”, such as the late Dr Liz Rhea. We must have more Dr. Liz Rhea’s and Dr. Tommy Johns to make our university have an excellent reputation as we approach 125 years and mid century...it’s not too early to think about 15-30 years from now. We do not need to be the “Family Dollar” of Higher Education. Sadly, our university and THEC leadership is gravitating towards that degree model in quantity vs quality. We need law. We need research. And, we need more consistency in winning championships. Our paltry endowment levels really speak for itself as far as what standing our university has nationally. Branding helps and is essential, but quality programs must also follow the branding to sustain a top tier, top notch reputation. I would like to be like a University of Cincinnati or Florida State University as my models.
However, we are approaching 20 years into the 21st century and we have students matriculating college who wasn’t alive in the 1900s or much less remember who we were in 90s, 80s, or 70s and we must improve branding to gain researchers, professors, and students to be a Tier 1 University. That’s what it’s all about as an institution: having terminal degrees, professional disciplines, and primary research. That is where money is and powerful “cheerleaders”, such as the late Dr Liz Rhea. We must have more Dr. Liz Rhea’s and Dr. Tommy Johns to make our university have an excellent reputation as we approach 125 years and mid century...it’s not too early to think about 15-30 years from now. We do not need to be the “Family Dollar” of Higher Education. Sadly, our university and THEC leadership is gravitating towards that degree model in quantity vs quality. We need law. We need research. And, we need more consistency in winning championships. Our paltry endowment levels really speak for itself as far as what standing our university has nationally. Branding helps and is essential, but quality programs must also follow the branding to sustain a top tier, top notch reputation. I would like to be like a University of Cincinnati or Florida State University as my models.
I am basically saying it does not matter. 20 years ago maybe, but the sports media and like you said our own state does not care about universities out of the power conferences. Just how it is more now than it was. There was always a separation, but they defined it with the P5 and G5. To some it may matter, but overall it would not. I just think winning in football and basketball would have a more positive impact and a name change I do not see as helping with that very much.
CR - I think another way to view this is why don't the powers to be ask for a name change? And why did North Texas and Memphis change their name and did it assist in increasing giving. (it did) I held your position years ago but have come around. I would actually rename it completely different, getting rid of Middle and State but can live with MTU or UMT. Changing the name more or may not help but keeping the name is not helping at all. Why not remove any barriers to being the best we can be? While we may have a few programs that have national attention, we do not get the respect we deserve.
Change the name. It can only help. It surely isn't going to make things any worse, as we are at rock bottom when it comes to perception and support.
We've literally changed nothing over the last 20 years. We only changed basketball coaches because we were forced to when Kermit left. Something has to change guys, even if just for the sake of change.
We are sitting in a sinking ship and nobody seems interested in trying anything BOLD. It's quite sad really.
I guess I get it though. This pathetic administration has been rewarded for continued mediocrity and passivity. "Don't rock the boat" should be the Universities new motto. Massaro and McPhee keep collecting those fat checks for doing all of nothing. Zero innovation. Zero boldness. Zero change. Same ole same ole' Little Middle State U.
Our administration and leaders should be ashamed of themselves.
We've literally changed nothing over the last 20 years. We only changed basketball coaches because we were forced to when Kermit left. Something has to change guys, even if just for the sake of change.
We are sitting in a sinking ship and nobody seems interested in trying anything BOLD. It's quite sad really.
I guess I get it though. This pathetic administration has been rewarded for continued mediocrity and passivity. "Don't rock the boat" should be the Universities new motto. Massaro and McPhee keep collecting those fat checks for doing all of nothing. Zero innovation. Zero boldness. Zero change. Same ole same ole' Little Middle State U.
Our administration and leaders should be ashamed of themselves.
I don't care if the name is changed or not. Really does not matter to me. You all can push for that if you want. I am not begrudging your opinions. I think a study needs to be done on how much it would cost to change the name. I cannot find very many peer reviewed academic studies on this. The few I have found have mixed results.
How many of you would give more money if the name were changed?
I would. I only donate to athletics. I would donate to the school as well if the name were changed - simply because it would demonstrate that it's finally taking it's brand seriously. It's ok. You are not alone in your view and it's not a disparagement that you don't understand the criticality of brand. A lot of people don't and just think it's a bunch about nothing. So, if you want to do some reading on peer reviewed journals do it on branding and you might be surprised by what you find.
But I don't suggest just a name change and nothing else. When/if it ever happens it should be done as part of a broader set of enhancements (such as new professional degree offerings or new strategic or global enhancement initiative/vision. In other words, you aren't just rolling out a name change you are announcing a new direction, a new path ahead for the 21st century which is now nearly a quarter gone. This is what North Texas, Memphis, Truman State and a few others I researched did. The difference in North Texas' situation is they have a state that encouraged one of their state schools to put itself on the path to a Tier 1 research institute rather than cuff it's hands like our dumbass state does.
The costs are irrelevant. The benefits have been demonstrated elsewhere particularly in the areas of fundraising but even if you zeroed in on costs you're talking about a fraction of 1% of the multi-million dollar budget it costs to operate the university on an annual basis. In a relative sense it's peanuts. I included that as part of my research with other institutions. They very much considered that a potential barrier as well only to realize not that big of deal. Hell, UT rebrands about every 15 to 20 years and every sign, building description, document, etc. has to be replaced.
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