Where's the Staff's EATT?

[MT01]

This is what kills me about our staff. They preach it but they damn sure don't do it in recruiting. Too much low hanging fruit out there available for the pickin. So, Walker Merrill entered the portal from UT. Localish kid. Out of Brentwood. A low 4-star rating. Never even received an offer from us out of HS. He did from UAB. And Memphis. And App State. And Charlotte. But not us. Think he's going to give a G5 much attention that didn't even bother to offer him out of high school? SMH.

This is indicative of one of three reasons why we have a. 500 program.

 

[SpaceRaider]

This is what kills me about our staff. They preach it but they damn sure don't do it in recruiting. Too much low hanging fruit out there available for the pickin. So, Walker Merrill entered the portal from UT. Localish kid. Out of Brentwood. A low 4-star rating. Never even received an offer from us out of HS. He did from UAB. And Memphis. And App State. And Charlotte. But not us. Think he's going to give a G5 much attention that didn't even bother to offer him out of high school? SMH.

This is indicative of one of three reasons why we have a. 500 program.

Frustrating as hell.

 

[SpaceRaider]

I don't like comparing different sports at MT. But when Savannah Wheeler entered the Portal at Marshall. IIRC the story correctly Matt Insell and another assistant coach were the first to contact her and she never considered any where else.

 

[SpaceRaider]

Meanwhile our FB coaching staff appears to be asleep at the wheel in most matters pertaining to running a FBS football program, but most of us knew that already.

 

[MTBig Blue]

I heard Stock on Chris Childers radio show a few weeks back. He was asked about the transfer portal and he said something to the effect of "we aren't going to do a ton of recruiting in the portal". In my opinion, we should be getting about half our class from there. I woukd honestly like to see all OL and DL recruited from the portal.

 

[MT01]

It doesn't fit their model to go out and do the recruiting of individuals that are already proven of FBS offers. That's too much work. Too hard. Not enough ROI. It's much easier to find somebody that doesn't have any legit D1 offers and make them think they're the greatest. It's way easier to do that. This is their model.

 

[MidTennMtneer]

I read an article the other day that Dykes brought 13 players in from the portal. Mainly to shore up his defense. That's essentially a whole class. And look at what he did. Lincoln Riley too. Yeah he lost to Tulane but none of us would fuss at an 11 win season.

It absolutely is part of it now and coaches who don't embrace it will be left wayyyyy behind.

If I was head coach, I'd have every position coach have a constant running list of needs and a GA doing nothing but portal watching during the windows to fill that list.

 

[MTLynn]

I heard Stock on Chris Childers radio show a few weeks back. He was asked about the transfer portal and he said something to the effect of "we aren't going to do a ton of recruiting in the portal".

He's busy recruiting Division II talent….

Stooge mcphee is to blame. He isn't a football fan and doesn't care. If he wasn't satisfied with the football program, coach .500 would be gone.

We know that 7-wood loves basketball because he overpaid for McDevitt.

 

[MidTennMtneer]

It doesn't fit their model to go out and do the recruiting of individuals that are already proven of FBS offers. That's too much work. Too hard. Not enough ROI. It's much easier to find somebody that doesn't have any legit D1 offers and make them think they're the greatest. It's way easier to do that. This is their model.

I get the whole diamond in the rough mentality. And we have found several great ones. But you can't hope every guy is that. Yeah it is a major guessing game, but at the same time ratings are there for a reason.

Chase after a few guys with only FCS offers, sure. But -66 yards in the bowl shows you have got to have FBS guys in the trenches.

 

[Sommy]

So the approach is to focus on high school and keeping kids in the system? Seems silly considering the current environment. The best kids in your system will transfer OUT and you never replenish with similar talent via the portal, then you are forced to go back to your bench and say next man up. This is not paying attention to the current environment we are in. Terrible approach.

I would recruit a lot of local kids out of HS even if it's a reach. If they go somewhere else, that is fine. In 2 years they might enter the portal and MT being geographically close might be your "in" with a kid. You would already have a connection. If you can't get them right out of high school, maybe you get them when they transfer out and want to come back closer to home.

This staff is completely missing the mark if they don't pay attention to local kids. And by local I mean within a 4-5 hour drive. Something that family members could reasonable drive to see there Son play on Saturdays.

 

[MidTennMtneer]

So the approach is to focus on high school and keeping kids in the system? Seems silly considering the current environment. The best kids in your system will transfer OUT and you never replenish with similar talent via the portal, then you are forced to go back to your bench and say next man up. This is not paying attention to the current environment we are in. Terrible approach.

I would recruit a lot of local kids out of HS even if it's a reach. If they go somewhere else, that is fine. In 2 years they might enter the portal and MT being geographically close might be your "in" with a kid. You would already have a connection. If you can't get them right out of high school, maybe you get them when they transfer out and want to come back closer to home.

This staff is completely missing the mark if they don't pay attention to local kids. And by local I mean within a 4-5 hour drive. Something that family members could reasonable drive to see there Son play on Saturdays.

I've seen this with several several players since the portal started.

They get offered from a local (as you said 4-5hrs) school, usually a G5, but also get offered a P5 or a PWO P5. They take that and realize they are on the bottom of the totem pole. They enter the portal and said local G5 contacts them immediately. Player is impressed the school still wants him and remembers the relationship started in high school.

Boom. Player transfers back home.

Even if we don't get them immediately, we have got to have relationships with local schools/players for that exact reason.

 

[MarJac23]

I heard Stock on Chris Childers radio show a few weeks back. He was asked about the transfer portal and he said something to the effect of "we aren't going to do a ton of recruiting in the portal". In my opinion, we should be getting about half our class from there. I woukd honestly like to see all OL and DL recruited from the portal.

Heck, it obvious that Stock is stuck in the old school way. Not receptive to change of any kind or anything new. He does not want to work the portal, sell this program to the public, or make changes to his staff.
Hell, he can’t (or won’t)even operate a Twitter presence.
I heard him on Greg’s s show say that the portal,was nothing more than a minor league to the P5.

 

[MT01]

Heck, it obvious that Stock is stuck in the old school way. Not receptive to change of any kind or anything new. He does not want to work the portal, sell this program to the public, or make changes to his staff.
Hell, he can’t (or won’t)even operate a Twitter presence.
I heard him on Greg’s s show say that the portal,was nothing more than a minor league to the P5.

#E.

 

[MT01]

When you look at what's going on here, it's pretty easy to recognize why this will be our last eight-win season or better until CRS is gone. Unless Rick figures out a way to fill a schedule with 12 teams who managed only two or three wins a year.

 

[mtfblue]

I spoke with Royston and he said they are going heavy JUCO and High School this class since it will be a small class. Why not take proven players that have played in the portal....smh

 

[MidTennMtneer]

I spoke with Royston and he said they are going heavy JUCO and High School this class since it will be a small class. Why not take proven players that have played in the portal....smh

About right. So far I think we have 3 transfers who have actually signed. Offers out for a few others I've seen on Twitter.

 

[RaiderDoug]

I said this in another post, but The Athletic had an article where it went around and sent surveys out to high schools in different states, and had about 8 different coaches in Tennessee respond.

When asked about MTSU, most of the respondents stated that they don't hear much from our staff. Meanwhile, they talk about how all the other schools are working them hard, even when they don't have a player that their interested in. One coach specifically said he doesn't hear much from MTSU, something along the lines of "that they're looking for a specific type of kid and if you don't have one they don't come around".

It's just low effort all around. Low effort, poor results.

 

[RaiderDoug]

Here you guys go:

How would you evaluate the Group of 5 schools in the state (Memphis and Middle Tennessee) and how they recruit your school?

Coach 1: Memphis (does the best job) by a long shot. They just do a better job than anyone else of paying attention to what’s going on. They do a spectacular job. Ryan (Silverfield) just doesn’t shoot you a bunch of crud and make stuff up about your kids. He tells you his real assessment, which I appreciate. I want to know what coaches really think.

Coach 2: The only school I don’t get a lot of love from is MTSU. They really don’t come here much. They have some good people on staff, but their process and how they do things is different. That’s on their head coach (Rick Stockstill). He’s a good guy, but he has his own way. They come in late a lot. They take their time. They don’t offer kids early. You have to fit right into the niche of their program to get an offer from their program. It’s not a bad thing, but other schools will jump in with you.

Coach 3: We hear from Memphis way more than we hear from MTSU. I think it’s philosophy, and I’m not in their staff meetings and could be speaking out of turn, but I don’t think MTSU even comes east to Knoxville at all. I think they just recruit Nashville and Murfreesboro because anybody the Power 5s don’t want, MTSU is a great Group of 5 option to stay home. They can simply stay in Nashville, get Memphis, Alabama and Georgia and be fine. I don’t think they’re worried about coming east. We don’t see them.

Coach 4: Well, first I’ll tell you that in the FCS, Scotty Walden at Austin Peay is doing a great job. Just phenomenal. He’s so engaging. … I’ll also say Tennessee Tech’s mega camp was a really good one, and Eddie George is doing a nice job at TSU. I went out to a TSU camp and was really impressed. It wasn’t just a money grab and it wasn’t just a “Show off Eddie George show.” They truly engaged with kids from all schools, getting to know them, doing the right kind of drills. And (defensive coordinator Brandon) Fisher was amazing. He has this way about him, gravitas, but he doesn’t throw it around. … For Group of 5, Memphis is probably the best. They do a great job. They ask the right questions.

Coach 5: I think both could do better, but Memphis is doing better now. Just have to keep it going. I have guys on the team there, and we try to get kids who can open doors for themselves and get them to stay home. A lot of times they want to get away from home. But Memphis has done a pretty good job and, hopefully, it keeps them going in the right direction. Middle, I think they can do a better job recruiting in-state.

 

[MidTennMtneer]

Do we have territories assigned? Like I know when Brown was hired at WVU (a lot has changed there since then) they put out a release announcing what areas each position coach was responsible for. Some had better TX ties, so assigned there. Better FL, etc.

Do we do that or is it just a throw a dart on the map mentality?

 

[MT01]

I remember back when Fresno kind of or almost became Boise before Boise did. They said they’re going to win the kids at home first to build their program. That’s how they ended up with the “V” on their helmets. It represents the San Joaquin Valley.

Hell we hardly even recruit in our own region. Our niche must be to recruit people that no one else is. That way no competition. Over the past 10 years Tenn HS football has become pretty good and producing a lot of D1 talent for its size. We don’t get hardly any of it. We don’t even offer them in a lot of cases.

How can you be a D1 head coach and not have good relationships with high school coaches in your own state? 17 years. 17

 

[Sommy]

Here you guys go:

How would you evaluate the Group of 5 schools in the state (Memphis and Middle Tennessee) and how they recruit your school?

Coach 1: Memphis (does the best job) by a long shot. They just do a better job than anyone else of paying attention to what’s going on. They do a spectacular job. Ryan (Silverfield) just doesn’t shoot you a bunch of crud and make stuff up about your kids. He tells you his real assessment, which I appreciate. I want to know what coaches really think.

Coach 2: The only school I don’t get a lot of love from is MTSU. They really don’t come here much. They have some good people on staff, but their process and how they do things is different. That’s on their head coach (Rick Stockstill). He’s a good guy, but he has his own way. They come in late a lot. They take their time. They don’t offer kids early. You have to fit right into the niche of their program to get an offer from their program. It’s not a bad thing, but other schools will jump in with you.

Coach 3: We hear from Memphis way more than we hear from MTSU. I think it’s philosophy, and I’m not in their staff meetings and could be speaking out of turn, but I don’t think MTSU even comes east to Knoxville at all. I think they just recruit Nashville and Murfreesboro because anybody the Power 5s don’t want, MTSU is a great Group of 5 option to stay home. They can simply stay in Nashville, get Memphis, Alabama and Georgia and be fine. I don’t think they’re worried about coming east. We don’t see them.

Coach 4: Well, first I’ll tell you that in the FCS, Scotty Walden at Austin Peay is doing a great job. Just phenomenal. He’s so engaging. … I’ll also say Tennessee Tech’s mega camp was a really good one, and Eddie George is doing a nice job at TSU. I went out to a TSU camp and was really impressed. It wasn’t just a money grab and it wasn’t just a “Show off Eddie George show.” They truly engaged with kids from all schools, getting to know them, doing the right kind of drills. And (defensive coordinator Brandon) Fisher was amazing. He has this way about him, gravitas, but he doesn’t throw it around. … For Group of 5, Memphis is probably the best. They do a great job. They ask the right questions.

Coach 5: I think both could do better, but Memphis is doing better now. Just have to keep it going. I have guys on the team there, and we try to get kids who can open doors for themselves and get them to stay home. A lot of times they want to get away from home. But Memphis has done a pretty good job and, hopefully, it keeps them going in the right direction. Middle, I think they can do a better job recruiting in-state.

Can you print this and mail a copy to Massaro and to Stock? The full article would be nice.

A silly little thing to do I know, but we can’t assume these guys actually know the perception of the program they run.

 

[MidTennMtneer]

I remember back when Fresno kind of or almost became Boise before Boise did. They said they’re going to win the kids at home first to build their program. That’s how they ended up with the “V” on their helmets. It represents the San Joaquin Valley.

Hell we hardly even recruit in our own region. Our niche must be to recruit people that no one else is. That way no competition. Over the past 10 years Tenn HS football has become pretty good and producing a lot of D1 talent for its size. We don’t get hardly any of it. We don’t even offer them in a lot of cases.

How can you be a D1 head coach and not have good relationships with high school coaches in your own state? 17 years. 17

I've often wondered the no competition thing myself.

It's like they are afraid to put too many offers out. Just incase guys don't go elsewhere and they are stuck with too many guys then and have to rescind.

So instead they only offer guys they are 100% sure they can get.

 

[MTLynn]

Can you print this and mail a copy to Massaro and to Stock? The full article would be nice.

little things know, but we can’t assume these guys actually know the perception of the program they run.

The three stooges need to see this. Not that anything will change until stooge mcphee is gone.

 

[FranklinRaider315]

Honestly, reading these coaches’ comments is like deja vu all over again from the last 3-4 years of the Tommy West era at Memphis. By the time he was run off, he had alienated nearly every HS coach in the Memphis Metro area except his buddy at CBHS and Freeze, who his son played two years for at Briarcrest. I’ve shared this before but one of my college teammates was the AD for Memphis Interscholastic Athletics Assn. (MIAA). He had the ear of every HS coach in Memphis and had organized barbecue cookouts at the South Campus Practice Facility for the coaches before home game weekends. They respected him as a former Tiger as many of them were. He told me he pleaded with and still couldn’t get West to attend the cookouts. Another Tiger Assistant who coached the aforementioned teammate of mine and was on his second stint at Memphis was recruiting in La. and needed West to make an in-home visit with him which again was refused.

I’ve known what the problem is. Now you all can read from the area HS coaches what they think of this staff.

 

[MT01]

Allow myself to elaborate on myself with my last statement. As long as Rick has been here he should have such deep entrenched connections across this state every coach in America (sans maybe Saban or Smart) should be like f*** Stockstill is here when said coach enters the state of Tennessee to recruit here and realizes Rick is after the same guy they are. But the reality is there isn’t a coach in America that has an iota of concern about recruiting against Stockstill. - even in Murfreesboro.

I’m not suggesting CRS leading a former Sun Belt and now a C-USA school should command that kind of respect across the nation or even in the southeast but after two decades he should at least be a force to be reckoned with from a recruiting perspective in the mid-state/Nashville viewing area or at least somewhere. But that’s simply not the case and wasn’t it “recruiting prowess” why he was hired in the first place?

 

[MT01]

I will say this however. I do think they have finally recruited the QB position better in recent years. It’s going to be a pretty good battle between Vattiato, Lowe, and Riles. On paper, these are guys that came out of HS with accolades who could be highly productive here but the same can’t be said at many positions around them. You can build around those guys but I have no confidence that’s being done. I hope I’m wrong.

 

[DisgruntledAlum]

 

[MidTennMtneer]

I will say this however. I do think they have finally recruited the QB position better in recent years. It’s going to be a pretty good battle between Vattiato, Lowe, and Riles. On paper, these are guys that came out of HS with accolades who could be highly productive here but the same can’t be said at many positions around them. You can build around those guys but I have no confidence that’s being done. I hope I’m wrong.

They all are still going to be running for their lives unless some major changes are made.

 

[Sommy]

It all goes back to mediocre expectations, no pressure to improve, laziness and general comfortability. That applies to all three stooges. If one from the three legged stool pushes the envelope, we might have a better program. But all 3 are deeply entrenched in their positions and completely aligned. .500 + Bowl is the goal.

If Stock marches out a .500 team, he goes to a bowl and the administration is happy. That's the low bar that has been set. In order to achieve a .500 team you don't have to push the envelope with recruiting. What has worked in the past in terms of talent, will probably continue to work going forward if .500 is your expectation/goal. Recruit kids from high school and hope you can beat out Austin Peay, TSU, Akron, TN Tech, etc. and you have your .500 team. Keep your friends as staff members and you have stability.

There is no real incentive for Stock to suddenly change his strategy. He's much closer to retirement than getting a higher paying coaching position (along with a lot of his aging staff that have no desire to remain "hungry"), so why rock the boat. I do agree it's mind boggling that as long as he has been here he hasn't built solid relationships with all the HS coaches. He should know every coach in the area by first name basis and have a rock solid relationship with them. At least leverage your stability for a recruiting angle, but it doesn't even sound like he does that.

 

[MidTennMtneer]

You are right. The .500 standard has been set and Stock has no incentive to improve. I'm sure PART of him wants to, but at the same time he knows what he has to do to keep is job and is content. We've all been there. I was an Asst. Mgr 20 years ago at Walgreens and the district big wigs could not understand why I was content and had no desire to move up. Sometimes you get that way. I was young and dumb though. Fresh out of college and thought I had it made. He is close to retirement so honestly I get it, but only to an extent. He should be smarter at 65 than I was at 22.

I've said before I blame McP the most. CM is month to month and I really get the feeling he sees some things differently but can only do so much. If he tells Stock to clean house of various assistants, Stock tells McP he doesn't want to and boom. CM is stuck. No power not having a contract.

Remarks McPhee has made show he just doesn't grasp the importance of athletics to build a university. Stock could leave tomorrow but unless they hire a young gun hot shot who is eager to move up (and we all know they won't because McP likes stability records be darned), there won't be major improvement in the standards until McP is gone.