FOOTBALL Stock Record Deep Dive

MidTennMtneer

All Conference
Gold Member
Nov 13, 2013
1,492
1,490
113
I debated adding this to the other Stock record thread, but I plan on updating this file each week now that it is done.
Will gladly add anything anyone wants. I'm a numbers guy and love doing stuff like this.

Includes:
Overall
Conference
FCS
FBS (total & against winning records)
G5 (total & against winning records)
P5
Records against all teams/conferences
1st half / 2nd half season records
WKU
Tennessee Schools

Link to view in new window (just copy and paste)
docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1u0dMe-FppxE66lrbfylgGHnGBftcCpQi9443klsGx9I/edit?usp=sharingF

As of Game 3 of 2022
 
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sWiley

Hall of Famer
Gold Member
Jul 25, 2012
5,933
2,804
113
16-56 vs. FBS teams with a winning record



holy....
 

MidTennMtneer

All Conference
Gold Member
Nov 13, 2013
1,492
1,490
113
16-56 vs. FBS teams with a winning record



holy....
Indeed. My next step this weekend is to add info for our conference each year. Number of winning teams, avg record etc. I guarantee it will be almost losing every year. Has to be. I know we are in a horrible conference, I just want the number proof. Haha.
 
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crposton

All Conference
Mar 22, 2018
1,393
939
113
I debated adding this to the other Stock record thread, but I plan on updating this file each week now that it is done.
Will gladly add anything anyone wants. I'm a numbers guy and love doing stuff like this.

Includes:
Overall
Conference
FCS
FBS (total & against winning records)
G5 (total & against winning records)
P5
Records against all teams/conferences
1st half / 2nd half season records
WKU
Tennessee Schools

Link to view in new window (just copy and paste)
docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1u0dMe-FppxE66lrbfylgGHnGBftcCpQi9443klsGx9I/edit?usp=sharingF

As of Game 2 of 2022
Does winning record include 6-6 or even 6-7 teams?
 

MidTennMtneer

All Conference
Gold Member
Nov 13, 2013
1,492
1,490
113
Does winning record include 6-6 or even 6-7 teams?

No it does not. I debated 6-6, but to me, that isn't a winning record. I don't think a .500 team should be in a bowl but it all is a $ grab.

Do outlets like ESPN, Athletic etc include 6-6 as a winning season? It isn't a losing season no, but still. @AustinLewis any idea?

I used final end of full season totals, not end of regular. So if a team finished 7-5 but lost champ game and bowl for example to finish 7-7, I did not include that as a winning record. Same for finishing 6-6 but losing bowl to 6-7 as you mentioned.

Open to thoughts on if that should be changed. Or maybe include both? Honestly even including .500 teams really wouldn't change it that much.
 

crposton

All Conference
Mar 22, 2018
1,393
939
113
No it does not. I debated 6-6, but to me, that isn't a winning record. I don't think a .500 team should be in a bowl but it all is a $ grab.

Do outlets like ESPN, Athletic etc include 6-6 as a winning season? It isn't a losing season no, but still. @AustinLewis any idea?

I used final end of full season totals, not end of regular. So if a team finished 7-5 but lost champ game and bowl for example to finish 7-7, I did not include that as a winning record. Same for finishing 6-6 but losing bowl to 6-7 as you mentioned.

Open to thoughts on if that should be changed. Or maybe include both? Honestly even including .500 teams really wouldn't change it that much.
I think it is fine how you did it. I may argue a team that finishes the season 7-5 should probably be included, but I doubt many 7-5 teams finished 7-7 and it wouldn't make much of a difference. I just decided to do record vs. teams with 6-wins since that is bowl eligibility and the standard Stock is held to apparently.
 
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Sommy

True Blue
Aug 2, 2001
953
545
93
The ones that stand out to me:

After 17 years of coaching:

.278 Winning record against G5 - so similar conferences when we play winning record teams we only beat them roughly 25% of the time. This is the main one for me. This is terrible over 17 years.

.222 Overall against FBS

.132 record against P5. So basically we never improved in 17 years

One request - what is the overall numbers for winning % against teams with a winning record?

Hey @ldeleon5 - want to print this off and put it on your boss' desk? Again, how did he get an extension for this performance?????
 
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MidTennMtneer

All Conference
Gold Member
Nov 13, 2013
1,492
1,490
113
15-39 vs. G5 with a winning record is worse. It is also very telling when a coach is barley above .500 and only 35.8% of his games are played against teams that finish the season with a winning record.

The fact that we play that few teams with winning records shows how bad our conference sucks. If I were AD, I'd have taken advantage of all those losing seasons for Rice, FIU and the like and whip them all. Be 10-2 every year. But for some reason they didn't take that approach. They got half way there and said , eh, good enough.

Someone with the mentality of Saban in this dept would go nuts. I mean literally have to be placed in an institution.

So is that a knock on Stock? No he's not Saban. Not saying that. But is he a coach that can only beat losing teams even with better resources, or is he a product of the expectations set on him? He didn't pick the schedule or the conference. (Not defending him, just opening discussion)
 

Sommy

True Blue
Aug 2, 2001
953
545
93
And one more stat I would like to see. Winning % of coaches with 5, 10 or 15 years at the same school. Stock has to be close to the bottom of that list.
 

AustinLewis

Hall of Famer
Staff
Sep 16, 2006
6,485
1,271
113
No it does not. I debated 6-6, but to me, that isn't a winning record. I don't think a .500 team should be in a bowl but it all is a $ grab.

Do outlets like ESPN, Athletic etc include 6-6 as a winning season? It isn't a losing season no, but still. @AustinLewis any idea?

I used final end of full season totals, not end of regular. So if a team finished 7-5 but lost champ game and bowl for example to finish 7-7, I did not include that as a winning record. Same for finishing 6-6 but losing bowl to 6-7 as you mentioned.

Open to thoughts on if that should be changed. Or maybe include both? Honestly even including .500 teams really wouldn't change it that much.
I can't speak for how ESPN or Athletic compile their stats.
 
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MidTennMtneer

All Conference
Gold Member
Nov 13, 2013
1,492
1,490
113
Updated to make winning record .500 or better after bowls. Really didn't change that much..because....

new tab for conference records. There hasn't been a single year in 16 years, ZERO, that our conference had an overall +.500 record.

Last year example
SEC 111-73
AAC 73-65
SBC 65-61
CUSA 84-94
 

Sommy

True Blue
Aug 2, 2001
953
545
93
Maybe I’m missing it, but what is his record overall against teams with a winning record?
 

MT Glenn

True Blue
Sep 19, 2005
950
1,396
93
His record against WKU is worse when you consider that he has lost 6 of the last 7. Also, the majority of his wins were when they were really bad. If they have a pulse, he gets exposed. This is their record in the years that we've won:

2008 : 2-10
2009: 0-12
2010: 2-10
2012: 7-5
2014: 8-5
2018: 3-9

I posted this earlier in the wrong thread, so I deleted it from the other one.
 

SpaceRaider

Blue Raider Legend
Gold Member
Jul 22, 2001
73,926
5,924
113
God's Country
His record against WKU is worse when you consider that he has lost 6 of the last 7. Also, the majority of his wins were when they were really bad. If they have a pulse, he gets exposed. This is their record in the years that we've won:

2008 : 2-10
2009: 0-12
2010: 2-10
2012: 7-5
2014: 8-5
2018: 3-9

I posted this earlier in the wrong thread, so I deleted it from the other one.
THIS is the #1 reason he should be fired. The #2 reason is his record against vandy (0-4). Because he is still our coach is the #1 reason both Massaro, and McPhee should be fired. I despise our 'leadership'

I used to have passion for MT football now I feel like a casual observer rubbernecking at a crash on the interstate.
 

JohnDavidBlue

All American
Sep 10, 2005
4,096
2,268
113
Do students pass the bill saying they will have a student athletic fee? If a student wanted to propose a bill to remove it or decrease it, is that something that would go through the SGA?
 

MidTennMtneer

All Conference
Gold Member
Nov 13, 2013
1,492
1,490
113
16-56 vs. FBS teams with a winning record

25-62 counting teams .500. I went ahead and adjusted it to include those for two reasons.

1. That's the standard for bowls
2. That's the standard set for extensions and the like so I wanted to see how he really compared against that.

If we were in a conference with a pulse it would be wayyyyy worse. For teams we had with us since Stock's beginning.
FAU before Kiffen's champ 2017 year 48-86
FIU in that span 41-93
UNT 39-95

What is sad is this. Stock started 2006. WKU didn't join the SBC until 2009. The two years we played them before they were Independent FCS (we lost) and Independent FBS. Their 8th AND 9th year in FBS they won Conference Championships. They are 88-80 since joining FBS. We are 90-86 in that same span. Not that much difference, EXCEPT for the Championships. Oh, and that WKU will fire a coach.
UAB won one the 2nd year back after not even having a program for 2 years, by beating us mind you.

And Stock can't win one in 16yrs.

Our true comparison should be against what we should strive to be. Conference Champs. Rewarding and bragging on beating up the FxUs of the world shows what our admin compares us to.
 
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Sommy

True Blue
Aug 2, 2001
953
545
93
16-56 vs. FBS teams with a winning record

So .22 winning percentage against teams with a winning record.

That sums it up overall performance pretty damn well. That’s who we have here folks. And our AD felt that warranted an extension after 17 seasons, with a bonus of auto extension if he wins 6 games. That’s where we are at as a program In case anyone was confused. Pretty damn depressing.
 

MidTennMtneer

All Conference
Gold Member
Nov 13, 2013
1,492
1,490
113
Just updated it for end of season. Final record against winning FBS/G5 can change by one game if UAB wins their bowl. They are the only team currently .500 we played this year. Bowl record of course will change as well.

Like I've said, I have major issues with Stock, and this is why. But he is here, so might as well accept that aspect of it, and push for other changes like staff. All we really can do.

Overall 108-103 (.512)
Conference (SBC & CUSA) 78-54 (.591)
FBS 98-101 (.492)
FBS Winning Record 25-65 (.278)
FBS Losing Record 73-36 (.670)
G5 92-68 (.575)
G5 Winning Record 23-47 (.329)
G5 Losing Record 69-21 (.767)
WKU 6-9 (streak L4)
Conf Champ Games 0-1
Bowls 3-6 (.333)
1st half of season 43-58 (.439)
2nd half of season 64-46 (.582)
Since 2018 division crown 21-27 (.438)
Since COVID 2020 Season 14-11 (.560)
Bowl Eligible 12/17
Winning Seasons 11/17